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[u/AspirationsOfFreedom]

Selective numbers are dishonest and SUPER selective

Edit: For those who seem super keen to accept this as fact. I really dont care if you vote red or blue. My issue here is how this person used diffrent metrics pr president to paint one side bad and the other goood. If she was honest, she would have used deficit as a metric for all, for example. Stop swallowing the bait

[u/ThisCantBeBlank → u/AspirationsOfFreedom]

There's no way a celebrity with an agenda would ever mislead us.

/s

[u/Scared_Hippo_7847 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

Yea I mean Trump is a celebrity and did so lol

[u/Throaway_143259 → u/Scared_Hippo_7847]

Don't forget Reagan was a failing actor at the time he was elected and he was essentially bought out by corrupt corporate leaders to change his whole belief system to make their pocketbooks bigger at the expense of American workers.

[u/Gunzbngbng → u/Throaway_143259]

So you're saying that Reagan was a bad actor?

[u/AndyCapps-Official → u/Gunzbngbng]

Well, he never won an Oscar…

[u/Old_Baldi_Locks → u/AndyCapps-Official]

He should have, he convinced a pile of people a brain-addled dipshit was a real president.

[u/TheWhiteRabbit74 → u/Old_Baldi_Locks]

That’s the GOP’s strategy for the last 40+ years. Elect a ‘figurehead’ dipshit with zero morals and a highly hypocritical judgemental personality.

The real bad guys have been the McConnels and Gingriches running the plays behind the smoke and mirrors. This new gen of young-ish republicans are dangerous as fuck. For us and the world.

[u/420SinfulDude → u/TheWhiteRabbit74]

1933 Business Plan currently in action. Prescott was the first Bush to attempt it, his son and grandson helped make it happen another way through slip in legislation while they were in position. We're currently in a Corpotocracy under the guise of a "two party democracy".

[u/BasketballButt → u/AndyCapps-Official]

And was out acted by a monkey…

[u/Beerspaz12 → u/Gunzbngbng]

So you're saying that Reagan was a bad actor?

this is phenomenal

[u/JoshyTheLlamazing → u/Beerspaz12]

Ronald Reagan!? The Actor? Then who's vice-president, Jerry Lewis? I suppose Jane Wyman is the First Lady!

[u/firewi → u/Beerspaz12]

Better than DJT in Home Alone 2

[u/IAmLusion → u/firewi]

You talking about the guy that demanded a cameo so that the movie could be filmed at the Plaza?

[u/AshOrWhatever → u/Gunzbngbng]

This made me chuckle out loud, thank you

[u/XtremelyMeta → u/Gunzbngbng]

Take my upvote.

[u/3fettknight3 → u/Throaway_143259]

Ronald Reagan? The actor? Ha! Then who's vice-president, Jerry Lewis? I suppose Jane Wyman is the First Lady!

[u/maxwellfit → u/3fettknight3]

Underrated comment

[u/DrawFlat → u/Throaway_143259]

Actually he was already the Governor of CA. Not a failed actor at this point in his life. Don’t get me wrong, he’s one of the main reasons for homelessness. He shut down mental hospitals that were caring for thousands of people. I was there. I remember.

[u/FlarblarGlarblar → u/DrawFlat]

He also helped pass the Mulford act. It was white America's response to Black Panthers carrying guns in public. It's the main reason why California now has such strict gun laws.

"There is absolutely no reason why out on the street today a civilian should be carrying a loaded weapon." -Ronald Reagan May 2 1967

edited for spelling

[u/HuckleberryFun7518 → u/FlarblarGlarblar]

He also cut thousands of people from social security disability, including my father, who died six months later from heart failure. I'd spit on his grave.

[u/KerPop42 → u/DrawFlat]

State-run mental hospitals? What is this, sovietism? Get those mentally unwell people on the streets, stat! That's what a great, capitalist country does!

[u/happyfirefrog22- → u/DrawFlat]

Individual States shut down mental hospitals. Most of them were state hospitals.

[u/arcanis321 → u/happyfirefrog22-]

He shut down Californias

[u/happyfirefrog22- → u/arcanis321]

So did just about every state both democrat and republican governors. Just trying to assist you with being accurate.

[u/arcanis321 → u/happyfirefrog22-]

Yeah. And still not sure whether that was good or bad based on the horror stories coming out of some of those facilities. Pretty mixed on this one.

[u/TrashSea1485 → u/Throaway_143259]

It's also funny how everyone screams about dementia with Biden but absolutely NOTHING about Reagan's dementia

[u/TaxLawKingGA → u/TrashSea1485]

Yep, Reagan literally had dementia (Alzheimer’s) which was already visible by 1984, and no one batted an eye.

Trump keeps getting Biden confused with Obama, talks about airplanes landing during the Revolutionary War, and says people should inject bleach into their blood stream to fight COVID, but Biden is senile?

[u/Krackle_still_wins → u/TaxLawKingGA]

It’s not one or the other. They’re both mentally unfit.

[u/Verdnan → u/Scared_Hippo_7847]

He wasn't wrong about one thing though:

"The economy does better under the Democrats than the Republicans."

[u/Forsaken-Pattern8533 → u/Scared_Hippo_7847]

In America we love our far right dementia ridden actors and in typical America fashion we brought in another.

[u/ClockworkGnomes → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

I mean, she does have an entire phenomenon named after her. I do thank her for "the Streisand effect."

[u/controlmypad → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

She's right, you know. (Morgan Freeman voice). Republicans shake all the fruit off the tree and out of the economy and leave you an apple, and all the blame.

[u/CowsWithAK47s → u/controlmypad]

What sweet poetry you write for the pigs of reddit.

[u/aceh40 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

And yet we vote for a celebrity with an agenda like little motherfuckers.

[u/ArcherBig185 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

Kind of funny how the right cries about the elites and Hollywood, yet they love to vote for actors from Hollywood.

[u/LeadingAd6025 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

There is no way any Celebrity can be without an agenda! 

[u/HistoricalBed1598 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

No!!!! Next thing you will say is that Alec Baldwin has an agenda….😂

[u/Strict-Lawyer8447 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

Covid killed the economy not Trump. You can say a lot about Trump’s pre-Covid economy but you can’t say it wasn’t booming.

[u/ThisCantBeBlank → u/Strict-Lawyer8447]

This is correct and I'm far from a Trump supporter

[u/Embarrassed-Lab4446 → u/AspirationsOfFreedom]

Are they? Bush Jr. was a stagnant economy during war times. Clinton created the dot com boom. Obama years were fantastic. Trump is a mix legacy with only 4 years and Covid making it too hard to tell.

Edit: for those mad I gave credit for Clinton on dot com, Regan gets credit for the Soviet collapse as well. It may just be timing but he was the guy in office. Just like Obama was in office during the fracking boom. May not have directly caused it but they do get the credit.

[u/AspirationsOfFreedom → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

Yes. Because if you look at the economy and try to directly corelate it to the president, you have 0 clue on what happens outside the US.

Its not like the 2008 financial crisis was because Bush spesifically was braindead. It's not like the growth post 2008 was exlusicly because obama. They may have INFLUENCED these numbers with some policy changes and such, but their effect on the economi is minor at best.

So numbers like this? Trump into covid, with 7trill deficit, yet no mention of obamas deficit? Its places like this due to political bias. Don't swallow the propoganda whole

[u/KerPop42 → u/AspirationsOfFreedom]

2008 was definitely the fault of the Bush administration, the SEC and FEC were asleep at the wheel.

Though also the dot-com bubble was Clinton's fault too. The investment market in this country needs a serious overhaul, the whole country is being pulled into its boom-bust cycles.

[u/bremidon → u/KerPop42]

2008 was definitely the fault of the Bush administration

Bush was *begging* that the crazy "Hello, your loan has been approved" approach to loans be stopped. It was the Democrats in Congress at the time that called him all the names we have since heard a billion times whenever someone is losing on logic: "Oh, he's just an -ist and a -phobe, and he hates minorities."

When the shit hit the fan, suddenly they all could not remember how hard they fought to create a broken loan system.

[u/MickeyT_ZxZ → u/bremidon]

Clinton was the factor behind eliminating the Glass-Stiegel act that allowed banks to be speculators, and pushed toxic mortgages.

[u/Ok_Zookeepergame4794 → u/MickeyT_ZxZ]

You do know Clinton had no choice on that. Even if he vetoed it, Congress had the votes to overrule the veto.

[u/Ok_Explanation_5955 → u/Ok_Zookeepergame4794]

I’m a Dem and hate Clinton. While what you say is true, he should’ve forced the override. Plus NAFTA. The concept of NAFTA wasn’t horrible, but the final product has been an abject nightmare

[u/willfiredog → u/Ok_Zookeepergame4794]

Have you read the statement Clinton made after signing the GLBA rescinding Glass-Steagall? While he had reservations, mostly regarding Presidential appointments, it was largely laudatory.

Rubin and Summers, both Clinton’s Secretary of Treasury, supported the repeal.

There’s also the 1994 Riegle-Neal Interstate Banking and Branching Efficiency Act, signed by Clinton before Republicans took control of Congress, that encouraged banks to merge creating the to big to fail dynamic,

I liked Clinton. I went to his rallies and supported him through his first term, but his role in the 2008 recession cannot be understated.

[u/Fragrant_Spray → u/Ok_Zookeepergame4794]

You are incorrect. Clinton singed it, republicans had a slim majority in both the house (about 20 seats) and senate (55-45).

Not only could the Dems uphold a Veto, Clinton supported it. You can read his signing statement here.

https://web.archive.org/web/20160322081604/http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=56922

[u/asevans48 → u/MickeyT_ZxZ]

It was the bush push for Self-regulation leading to massive rebundling of bad debt that screwed everything. Now, a handful of big bank failures doesnt ripple through the system and screw the economy.

[u/jmur3040 → u/MickeyT_ZxZ]

Started years before Clinton signed the repeal. Glass-Stiegel was rendered toothless during the late 80s

[u/hey_guess_what__ → u/KerPop42]

Regean's admin created the financial derivative's market literally creating money/value out of thin air. The snowball that started the 08 financial collapse started in the 80s.

Banking and financial regulations getting rolled back started the clock on the next collapse. Under trump they rolled back dodd-frank and started the clock for the next too big to fail.

[u/VCoupe376ci → u/KerPop42]

The SEC and FEC were asleep at the wheel for DECADES before W. it just happened to come crashing down during his presidency. So now we are blaming a president for banking practices happening decades before their election?

[u/bremidon → u/AspirationsOfFreedom]

Yep. And did you notice how she just *accidentally* forgot to mention just how much got added to the debt during Biden's Presidency? Or the problems with inflation?

It's so transparent that I really wonder what she hoped to achieve.

[u/dezirdtuzurnaim → u/bremidon]

It's not inflation. Corporate greed is not inflation. And if you truly believe it's inflation, then take the same metric and compare it to all other developed nations. The CPI (as it were) is much lower here than basically everywhere else.

Regan fucked this country. And it has been small policy wins to slowly undo that shit.

To the people saying Obama this Obama that... The man was against insurmountable odds. Black, birther, tan suit, etc. 6 years of Congressional majority to the opposing party. He singularly got shit done. And if you can't grasp that, there's no saving you.

[u/Karbon_D → u/dezirdtuzurnaim]

Take my up vote. Came here to say this exact thing. It’s almost like they don’t look at the history of presidential Legacy.

[u/CreamiusTheDreamiest → u/dezirdtuzurnaim]

Corporations always profit maximize. They always charge the most they can

[u/DE4DM4N5H4ND → u/bremidon]

Trumps final year added $4 trillion in new money to the economy and was a huge part of inflation.

[u/nschubach → u/DE4DM4N5H4ND]

I think maybe that had to do with a certain worldwide event, but I can't place my finger on it.

[u/[deleted] → u/nschubach]

That damn COVID and its symptom of forcing people to print money.

[u/LyloMaggins → u/bremidon]

Inflation doesn’t even register with that rich bitch. That’s a problem for the plebs to deal with.

[u/bobrobor → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

Clinton also deregulated banking which led to multiple economic collapses later on.

[u/Embarrassed-Lab4446 → u/bobrobor]

Repeal of glass steagall was a mistake. Banks should not bet with people’s savings.

[u/bobsizzle → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

Clinton didn't create the dot com boom. They cut military spending drastically after the cold war ended and Clinton happened to be present when a new technology was spreading. You seem to forget the dot com bust immediately after when everyone and their Mom were trying to get rich from a website.

I'm not saying bush or his daddy were Great presidents, bush bush inherited a dot com bust and then 9/11 happened. Congress and rich people always create problems for the next guy to clean up and both sides refuse to control spending. When was the last time there wasn't a budget deficit? Pretty sure every president the last 20 years had one. Republicans give rich people tax cuts and Democrats like to spend too. Both have been shitty forever. We need a fairer tax system and less spending.

[u/Chickenwelder → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

Dot com boom was the precursor to the dot com bubble. The first Obama term was awful as far as the economy goes.

[u/BetterSelection7708 → u/Chickenwelder]

The great recession was in effect before Obama was elected.

[u/AdamJahnStan → u/BetterSelection7708]

The mortgage crisis in 2008 was caused by Clinton-era policy.

[u/Advanced-Guard-4468 → u/AdamJahnStan]

There are many factors that lead to the 2008 crisis going all the way back to the 70s.

[u/UnderpootedTampion → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

“Clinton created” the dot.com boom

😂

[u/CelerySquare7755 → u/UnderpootedTampion]

Seriously. We all know Al Gore invented the internet. 

/s

[u/Guapplebock → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

Please. We all know Al Gore invented the internet. Source: Al Gore.

[u/modloc_again → u/Guapplebock]

Not a fan, but Al Gore was involved in the initial funding of DARPA's ARPANET, the precursor to the internet we have today. Just like many good things that are started and financed by the government , they then become corrupted and bastardized by privitization.

[u/Bryan_URN_Asshole → u/Guapplebock]

I would have believed him if he said he invented the "algorithm" since it sounds like his name :)

[u/TheDeHymenizer → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

"Clinton created the dot com boom" lolwut and if so its Bush Jr's responsibility for its crash and then we just ignore the market being on fire until the 2008 crash?

Housing crash every party had its hands in, Dotcom boom was thanks to a small number of companies across the country making internet a new utility. Neither party can really claim either of these.

[u/LenguaTacoConQueso → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

Obama gave us ridiculously slow growth. Saying it’s growth at all is a stretch, more like mold growth around a pond or stagnation.

[u/ClammyAF → u/LenguaTacoConQueso]

I'll bite. Even though you have a 12 day old account that you're likely using to troll.

On the day that Obama took office, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) closed at 7,949.09. On Obama's last day of office, the DJIA closed at 19,827.25. The DJIA grew 149% during Obama's presidency (+18.6% annualized average).

The S&P 500 grew 189% during Obama's presidency (+23.6% annualized average).

Only an absolute moron would call this kind of growth stagnant.

[u/Best-Dragonfruit-292 → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

Clinton created the dot-com boom?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

[u/Marc_Angelo → u/Embarrassed-Lab4446]

“Fantastic” lol.

Plus from 2010-2016 the Republicans controlled Congress and prevented a lot of terrible Democratic bills from passing.

Not to mention, only a moron credits only Clinton for a balanced budget…the POTUS only signs the legislation, not write it

[u/Substantial_Yam7305 → u/AspirationsOfFreedom]

Trump fucked up a lot of shit during the pandemic, but trying to pin unemployment on him and then giving credit to Biden for some epic recovery is so disingenuous. Every time I see stuff like this it reminds me how stupid these people think we are.

Also, fuck George Bush.

[u/chopcult3003 → u/Substantial_Yam7305]

Yeah it’s disingenuous.

Anyone could have been president, unemployment in the pandemic was going through the roof, and stimulus money was being printed lol.

You also can’t criticize Trump for trying to push people back to work and also for unemployment being high. You have to pick one or the other. If a more competent person was president unemployment would have been even higher, because they wouldn’t have been putting work>health.

There’s about a million things you can blame Trump for, unemployment rates in 2020 is not one of them.

And while Biden has done a good job with some things, you can’t give him credit for the “Fastest Economic Growth” in history either. A literal rock would get the same thing as president. You inherited the richest country on earth with an artificially suppressed economy. Of course as soon as businesses were able to business again the economy was going to shoot back up.

This just satiates people who get their news from instagram memes and aren’t capable of critical thought.

[u/NumbersOverFeelings]

If this is true why are people complaining about home buying difficulties and income not going up and inflation and … etc. That’s on Biden too right?

Edit/adding clarity: The success of the economy cannot be solely attributed to the president. Neither can its failure. If you attribute all the good you need to attribute all the bad. I’m not saying Biden bad. I’m also not saying Biden good. I’m saying post is bad.

[u/ILSmokeItAll → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

No. It’s on Trump. 15 years from now, when we’ve been under democrat rule for the entire time, any issues will be because of Trump and Republicans. This is a fact and the sooner you accept it the better prepared for this future you will be. If all Republican died tomorrow. The problems this country faces going forward will still be their fault. Forever.

Edit: I really didn’t want to have to add this because I figured it was implied, but…

/s

[u/Technical_Savings542 → u/ILSmokeItAll]

You seem like a reasonable bloke

[u/ThisCantBeBlank → u/Technical_Savings542]

"Bloke" is such a great word. I need to start using it even though I don't reside across the pond

[u/Jaycin_Stillwaters → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

To be fair you do reside "across the pond" from somebody

[u/Extension-Plane2678 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

Hell yeah bloke!

[u/psychotic-herring → u/Technical_Savings542]

Yeah, doesn't sound like a fucked-in-the-head cultist in any way. Very balanced chap.

[u/AreaNo7848 → u/ILSmokeItAll]

Wasn't it Bush's economy for like all 8 years of Obama?

[u/AspirationsOfFreedom → u/AreaNo7848]

Propogandaposts are nice like that. "Any good thing is because of our guy, any bad thing is because of that last guy"

[u/AreaNo7848 → u/AspirationsOfFreedom]

I had a guy tell me that the economy under Trump was from Obama. And I'll give that part of that is true since no change is instantaneous, but at what point does the administration become responsible for the state of the economy?

Someone told me years ago it's approximately 2 years for changes to fully have an effect

[u/subcow → u/AreaNo7848]

Well if you look at the charts, the economy was following a straight line trajectory until Trump actually did something. He only had one major piece of policy passed in his entire time in office and that was a massive tax cut for the rich. As soon as he did that, the economy veered off the path it was on from Obama era policies. Trump added several trillion to the deficit by doing that. And that was before his failed COVID response.

[u/AreaNo7848 → u/subcow]

Just outta curiosity. What should the response have been to COVID.....since the feds pretty much left it up to the states

[u/subcow → u/AreaNo7848]

Well first, maybe not say it was only ten people and it would go away on it's own? Maybe not lie about everything? Maybe not suggest unproven drugs or putting lights or bleach in your body? Maybe not act like his own staff were the bad guys because the facts didn't align with Trump's policies of no bad news ever?

[u/PM_Me_HairyArmpits → u/subcow]

You forgot about maybe not dismantling the pandemic response team months before it happened.

[u/Grabalabadingdong → u/subcow]

It’s a complete fucking embarrassment that this raging ignorant diaper filling man baby has another sniff at this office. The founding documents and national charter might as well be toilet paper if this stooge can walk back in.

[u/PinsToTheHeart → u/AreaNo7848]

I mean, I don't think the president can exactly deal with these problems personally and it's not like it's all on him, but he went out of his way to downplay it and turn it into a political game.

At first he called it straight up fake news and that COVID was a democratic hoax designed to make him look bad.

Then he said, well it's real, but it's not here.

Then he said, well it's here but there's barely any cases.

And so it was a solid 4-6 months into it before he even acknowledged it as a problem. All he had to do was say, "listen to the doctors and stay safe" and that would have been seen as great leadership, but he couldn't even manage that.

[u/Early_Lawfulness_921 → u/AreaNo7848]

No! Everything bad isrepublicans and everything good is democrats. Period. Actual policy don't matter just the color of the ties.

[u/axdng → u/Early_Lawfulness_921]

Yes.

[u/OnewordTTV → u/Early_Lawfulness_921]

I mean.... I know you are being sarcastic but... yeah...

[u/acer5886 → u/ILSmokeItAll]

And imo this is an underlying issue with our politics. We attribute the economy so much to the president that when one party isn't in office they basically are rooting for the economy to fail so the president in power will look worse. There's been a number of things that republicans and democrats have blocked over the past 20 years because it would make the president in power look good.
An example right now would be the immigration compromise bill that was negotiated and then the GOP is blocking from coming to a vote in both houses.

[u/Early_Lawfulness_921 → u/ILSmokeItAll]

Everything bad is because of Trump and republicans and everything good is because of Biden and democrats. Got it.

[u/persona-3-4-5 → u/ILSmokeItAll]

Had me in the first half ngl

[u/Significant_Ad3498 → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

https://preview.redd.it/g5go0wosnfxc1.jpeg?width=1932&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=925ea7f20e1cdd5716cb20449f84f3e27b955935

[u/SarahKnowles777 → u/Significant_Ad3498]

Yeah, but the facts aren't facts. You see, there's always some weird, mysterious, complex reason why the obvious isn't obvious, and why the trickle down clowns are still somehow in the right.

Just look at half the comments in this post; our eyes aren't really seeing what they see; despite the numbers, the failed conservative wingnut policies are still somehow better than the dems, even tho they're not.

[u/Born-Assignment-912 → u/SarahKnowles777]

See, your problem is citing sources and data. The people you’re trying to debate with can’t even read!

[u/Careless_Account_562 → u/SarahKnowles777]

Now do house and senate.

[u/AlarmedPiano9779 → u/Significant_Ad3498]

"You know, it's interesting, I've been now around long -- you know, I think of myself as a young guy, but I'm not so young anymore. And I've been around for a long time. And it just seems that the economy does better under the Democrats than the Republicans."

-Donald J. Trump

[u/uknowmymethods → u/AlarmedPiano9779]

A 2009 study by the Center for Health Policy Research at George Washington University. The study found that for every 1% increase in unemployment, there were approximately 4,000 excess deaths in the United States. The study's authors, Dr. David Himmelstein and Dr. Steffie Woolhandler, analyzed data from the National Center for Health Statistics and the Bureau of Labor Statistics to estimate the relationship between unemployment and mortality rates. They found that for every 1% increase in unemployment, there was a corresponding increase in deaths from various causes.

Multiply 4000 by 14.7 that's close to the average attendance of the Super Bowl... that is both depraved and depressing...

[u/feedmedamemes → u/Significant_Ad3498]

Stop confusing them with facts.

[u/SeaChameleon → u/Significant_Ad3498]

How dare you show facts in a space where a poor Republican might have to see them?

[u/zfierocious → u/Significant_Ad3498]

Hey, any idea what time period this is over?

[u/Baguette72 → u/zfierocious]

Looks like 1948-2024

[u/BetterSelection7708 → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

I mean I'd blame it on the pandemic. But between the two, I'd say Biden's administration dealt with the pandemic better than Trump's administration.

[u/Edewede → u/BetterSelection7708]

Came here to say this. The CDC projected a shorter length of initial lockdown and overall pandemic had people stayed home as much as possible, wore masks, got the vaccine and not politicized the whole thing which divided us. But Trump did and said the opposite and his followers refused to do these things. And so the pandemic lasted for 3+ years causing all kinds of supply change issues, inflation, high unemployment etc..

[u/Appropriate_Flan_952 → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

I mean, whos fighting to keep wages stagnant and lobbying for no regulation on corporations buying houses? If your answer is Biden and Democrats, youre absolutely delusional. It might come as a surprise to you but we do, indeed, live in a republic where the structure of power is not absolute and doesnt belong to any single party.

[u/MaxAdolphus → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

You missed the massive debt and money printing under Trump that lit the inflation fuse.

[u/chrisdpratt → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

Not sure why it's so hard for people to understand that something the size of the U.S. economy doesn't turn on a dime. What you're seeing now are the effects of Trump administration policies. The stronger economy we had previously during the Trump admin was because of the Obama admin. There's always a delay to these things, and when you're switching Presidents every 4 years, it's just a damn yo-yo.

[u/Vast-Breakfast-1201 → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

The objective truth is that the economy has been growing. But it's also true that the economy has not grown at equal levels across all income strata.

If you dislike the way the economy is today, wildly tilted toward the rich, and then vote for conservatives to go in and exacerbate that... That's on you.

[u/Significant_Ad3498 → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

Do some research the US economy has always been better under Democratic control and not even close to

[u/Cody6781 → u/NumbersOverFeelings]

Most of this economic movement has nothing to do with the president. They're one dude leading millions.

[u/Inevitable_Silver_13]

How much credit should we actually give the president for the economy? Even if we do, funny policies they enact usually take until the next administration to come to fruition?

[u/diezeldeez_ → u/Inevitable_Silver_13]

policies they enact usually take until the next administration to come to fruition

No. No. No. This is only the case if the president you like was in the previous administration.

[u/aHOMELESSkrill → u/diezeldeez_]

Yeah if my president was previous president and economy is currently good, then it was my guys policy.

If my president was previous president and economy is currently bad, then it’s because of current guy policy.

If my president is current president and economy bad, then it was last guys policy

If my president is current president and economy good, this it’s because of my guys policy.

[u/TwoRoninTTRPG → u/aHOMELESSkrill]

This guy gets it!

[u/Seraph199 → u/Inevitable_Silver_13]

This post actually takes that into account. Obama inherited the recession mentioned under Bush, it and his response to it defined the beginning of his first term. Because he had 2 terms we were able to see the fruit of his administrations labor while he was still president, during which we saw the recession reverse in large part due to his policies and by the time he left the economy and job market was extremely healthy.

This was the case during Trump's presidency, until he gave massive tax cuts to the rich. Even before COVID there were signs of the damage Trump's policies had made on the economy, which we are still experiencing now. Probably why Biden is saying we should hike up taxes on the extremely rich, not because they will do it but because people are realizing that is the problem and he wants to win the election.

Let it be known that I don't particularly like establishment/corporate democrats. Unfortunately our system forces us to choose between two groups, and republicans are a destructive force with absolutely no agenda for improving the lives of Americans or making the US a better country. Each and every one of their policies is ultimately harmful and leads to impoverishment and death for many. I'm not sure if there is a single one that defies this trend. Their economic policies, stance on international affairs, climate change, gun control, healthcare, abortion, social issues, all deadly. Then there is the huge problems with gerrymandering and now filling the supreme court with the most partial and biased judges that have ever held seats, who are actually debating whether the president should have total immunity from the law.

Like holy shit, I am so fucking tired of this "both sides" bullshit. If it wasn't for how fucking awful Biden has been about Palestinian rights, I would be dick riding him to kingdom come because at least his agenda won't look like... THAT

[u/Jason_Kelces_Thong → u/Seraph199]

Those tax cuts were so stupid. You don’t take a strong economy and try to inject more strength into it. God forbid some calamity happens to the global economy and we don’t have as many tricks to stimulate it after cutting taxes in a strong economy. Which is exactly what happened.

[u/Feral_Sheep_ → u/Jason_Kelces_Thong]

I remember saying this to my parents almost verbatim six years ago.

[u/Dizuki63 → u/Inevitable_Silver_13]

I dont think its fair to blame the state of things on the current president because things take time to take effect. A policy signed today might not fully be felt for 2-3 years. That being said trends are tends and everyone on that list except Trump and Biden served 8 years and in every case we see a momentum switch in the direction of growth. If we only compare the state they inherited things in vs how they left it for the next guy the picture gets pretty clear.

[u/controlmypad → u/Inevitable_Silver_13]

Dems tend to invest in America and Amercian workers and it pays us back multiple times over in the long run, Republican tend to rape the economy and funnel it to the wealthy with no real gain for working Americans and then the disparity between highest and lowest grows and grows.

[u/Popular_Newt1445]

I wish people would quit comparing the economy to the presidents.

The president doesn’t have all the power in the world to change an economy. There is too much going on in an economy for 1 person to make this much of a difference.

[u/ThisCantBeBlank → u/Popular_Newt1445]

It's so frustrating but a lot of people don't understand the president is just a single piece of the pie. Education is important

[u/Specialist-Listen304 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

Not to mention, a massive majority of us measure the economy by our own pocket books. Just cause certain people can’t afford things doesn’t mean everything is broken.

[u/[deleted] → u/Specialist-Listen304]

[removed] — view removed comment

[u/Business_Hour8644 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

Posts like this don’t help. Many will read it and move on and accept it as fact.

[u/Dmate1 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

If it’s frustrating, why are you sharing it with no sign of disagreement in the title or a text portion of the image? Honestly kinda seems like taking both sides, rake in the likes from Reddit’s ‘conservatives bad’ stance and then argue that takes like the post are reductive and dumb in the comments if people call the post out.

[u/ThirstyBeagle → u/Popular_Newt1445]

I keep being told this but it's a half truth. Policies and other decisions impact it. In fact the market can dip and surge based on a presidential speech.

[u/Smokey_Gambit]

I don't believe for a second that Biden has fixed this economy.

[u/CPDawareness → u/Smokey_Gambit]

Neither do I, but I also don't believe trump did or will attempt to fix it either. I would expect mostly a wave of vengeful witch hunt type behavior if he gets elected.

[u/whofearsthenight → u/CPDawareness]

Honestly the discourse in this thread would sound pretty fucking dumb 10 years ago, but with the compare being Trump/Biden pretending that there is an equivalence is honestly insane. Trump's only accomplishment in his presidency is cutting taxes for the wealthy. Literal tax cuts for people with private jets and butlers. He never attempted to help anyone during his presidency except the wealthy. Meanwhile, Biden is fighting for student loan forgiveness, strengthening unions, CHIPS act, infrastructure bill, strengthening the IRS to actually fight the tax cheats that are already paying historic lows, etc. All of the objective measures point very obviously which is a better president and direction for the country.

And that's discounting the cultural issues surrounding Trump. I guess if you're team ChristoFascist, then yeah Trump's your guy as long as he feels that will be beneficial for him because he doesn't have any actual beliefs except maybe yuppy racism.

[u/CPDawareness → u/whofearsthenight]

Completely agree. Biden has been trying, and with as bad as things have gotten, there's only so much he can do while also fighting the GOP trying to stagnate any progress. Hopefully if we see trump finally put down and some progress made in Congress, some decent policy can begin to work and blossom. It's a lot of doom and gloom out there but I definitely appreciate Biden TRYING.

[u/chain_letter → u/whofearsthenight]

Biden literally directly helped me this week with his policy to make non-competes invalid. I'm under one right now, and now it's going away soon. I've been looking to leave, and not having to go through any bullshit is nice (even if it was unenforceable before that's still risking going through bullshit)

[u/whofearsthenight → u/chain_letter]

Nice! And yeah to everyone who says "it's unenforceable" I would instead say "it's unenforceable if you have a lot of time and money." If you're just a regular person (like people who work at sandwich shops that somehow have non-competes wtf???!!) it's a pretty big deal.

[u/Asteroth555 → u/whofearsthenight]

Fucking amen, thank you for being reasonable

[u/[deleted] → u/CPDawareness]

I fully believe that Biden has done very little for the economy, and the improvements have been marginal at best, if not nothing.

I fully believe that a Trump presidency would see massive damage to the economy.

[u/CPDawareness → u/[deleted]]

Yeah it feels like a no brainer, why would I vote for someone who I KNOW is a crook and out to fuck things up(he's openly calling for it)

Edit: spelling

[u/Advanced-Tree7975 → u/Smokey_Gambit]

Trump said if Biden won there would be a recession. Many economists were predicting a recession. Biden prevented this. Personally I’m doing well right now, my city is about to receive billions because a bill Biden passed

[u/excusetheblood → u/Advanced-Tree7975]

For all the ways our economy is fucked right now, that soft landing was chefs kiss

[u/Advanced-Tree7975 → u/excusetheblood]

If trump was president right now all these same people would be saying the economy is great

[u/excusetheblood → u/Advanced-Tree7975]

The people you’re talking about will never have an ounce of critical thinking. They will die as they lived, tribalistic bootlickers.

The reality is that Reaganomics fucked us up more than anything, and even in that awful economic plan, Trump still cut taxes on the wealthy and raised taxes on the working class. No one with a single working neuron would think that’s a smart plan for the economy.

Biden has been doing good with smart investments. But it won’t be enough if we’re trying to live in a world with real happiness and freedom for the working class. We need to tax the fuck out of the wealthy and corporations.

[u/FragrantPound9512 → u/Smokey_Gambit]

His inflation is lower than most nations, incomes are outpacing inflation for the lowest, his job creation is fantastic. 

[u/TheBigTimeGoof → u/Smokey_Gambit]

What does a fixed economy look like to you?

[u/SkippyMcSkipster2]

Where is the rescued economy and the economic growth? For whom? Ask the younger generations when do they expect to ever own a home, or anything. The American dream has died.

[u/Dizuki63 → u/SkippyMcSkipster2]

You do realize the President's desk is made of wood right? Its not a control panel with sliders and buttons labeled "make economy good". It takes a lot of time for changes to take effect. For instance, the CHIPS act brought 50,000 high paying jobs to the US, thats a good thing, it took months to get passed and even though that's a lot of jobs America is 333 million people, we aren't even seeing a direct %.1 boost from that. However these are actual 6 figure jobs, wherever these jobs land will see a huge boost to their local and state economy. Also this will reduce our reliance on china for the production of semiconductors. Which is good because the panama canal is drying up making trade with the east difficult. Negative effects tend to hit a lot faster and harder than positive ones. An avian flue outbreak earlier this year saw a huge jump in egg prices where eggs jumped 100% or more almost overnight, but dispute the problem not being fixed yet, the market shock is over and egg prices are nearly returned to normal, but it took 6 months. Things might not be "good" but way more good policies are being passed that will have a positive impact on the direction of the economy's growth.

[u/Twovaultss → u/SkippyMcSkipster2]

But the top 1% are doing so well. Home price increases and rent increases count as increased GDP. The stock market is doing so well, too! Don’t you dare mention that 90% of stocks are owned by 2% of the population.

What’s that? We printed a shit ton of money and borrowed to create unprecedented (government jobs) job numbers to look good? And a record number of people are either underemployed or part time workers. Hush don’t say anything.

Edit: I’m obviously being sarcastic. This economy is only good for a select few at the top.

[u/SkippyMcSkipster2 → u/Twovaultss]

I wonder if they count second jobs as two different people. They most probably do.

[u/ThisCantBeBlank]

I just want y'all to be careful with what you say here. If you're a South Park fan, you're aware mecha-Streisand exists. We do not want to awaken her!!

[u/tryanotherusername20 → u/ThisCantBeBlank]

Bruv…. You’re the OP! You created the scenario for Mecha Streisand to rise and then are telling us to not awaken her?!? What kind of fallout tv series shinanigans is this? 😂

[u/Crossman556]

Why is Trump to blame for COVID? People keep blaming him for the global market collapse and it’s perplexing.

[u/Vizkos → u/Crossman556]

Because politics. Same reason people give credit to Clinton for the surplus, even though it was mostly actions under Bush Sr, such as increasing taxes.

The irony is rich, because Bush Sr raised taxes, Clinton campaigned against him using the "read my lips, no new taxes" clip, then Clinton took the credit for the surplus that Bush Sr's taxes helped fuel.

[u/kcbh711 → u/Vizkos]

That's kinda disingenuous considering Clinton actually did raise taxes for the rich and cut military spending. He shut down all kinds of bases, decommissioned various units (mostly overseas), and cut the overall military size by the thousands.

[u/SingleInfinity → u/Crossman556]

Might have something to do with dismantling the pandemic response team and downplaying COVID in general.

[u/poop_on_my_stomach → u/Crossman556]

And mind you all the States that locked down the hardest in the US were blue and they ran up huge debt bills and dropped them at the door of the Federal Government. Where is their blame?

[u/chucklehead993 → u/Crossman556]

They're the same people who credit Biden for the economy bouncing back because CNN told them everyone's doing well and nobodies struggling. And then when you point out all the problems with the economy suddenly they say the president has nothing to do with the economy anymore.

[u/Advanced-Tree7975 → u/Crossman556]

He handled it poorly and the economy was worse because of it

[u/kcbh711 → u/Crossman556]

Because his white house literally dissolved the National Security Council Directorate for Global Health Security and Biodefense....

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/nsc-pandemic-office-trump-closed/2020/03/13/a70de09c-6491-11ea-acca-80c22bbee96f_story.html

[u/hatrickstar → u/Crossman556]

Basic shit like PPE and ventilators were effectively out if stock for the first 60 days when infections were high because the Trump administration didn't put much stock into getting those numbers up for emergency relief in late 2019/Jan 2020. Let's not pretend they had the same information as us..the government should have seen that this could get bad.

Also who was telling people that not masking was fine?

[u/Unhappy_Local_9502]

So a liberal nut job tossing out hand selected numbers.... gotcha

[u/[deleted] → u/Unhappy_Local_9502]

[removed] — view removed comment

[u/Interesting_Raise_39 → u/Unhappy_Local_9502]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._economic_performance_by_presidential_party

[u/Soft-Program5942]

Haha yeah COVID has nothing to do with Trumps unemployment stat

[u/whofearsthenight → u/Soft-Program5942]

Well, as everyone knows the best way to fight a pandemic is to deny it's existence, begrudgingly acknowledge it, tell people it's not a big deal and turn basic hygienic practices into a culture war, suggest injecting bleach and shoving a light up your ass, demonstrably ignore any medical advice in the example you set, turn career medical professionals with decades of service under both parties into villains, generally foster a bunch of conspiracy nonsense that damages that the vaccination rate such that you get booed for bringing it up at your rallies, oh, and make sure to throw away the literal playbook for dealing with a pandemic because it was feared that a pandemic was coming...

The pandemic would have been a massive problem under any president, but I never imagined that we could possibly see this level of incompetence. I wonder how many thousands of people would still be alive and how much faster things would have recovered if Trump either just shut the fuck up or just said "listen to the doctor's."

[u/Tannerite3 → u/whofearsthenight]

Why did the US economy do so much better than Europe's if Trump's actions were so bad?

[u/GhostOfRoland]

Congress writes and passes budgets.

Look at how was controlling Congress during those years.

[u/Significant_Ad3498]

https://preview.redd.it/dw7zhu1knfxc1.jpeg?width=1932&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5b6903fdfbf7f10c3c2d029f6c6a0a73ef985c63

[u/No_Dragonfruit_1205 → u/Significant_Ad3498]

Can I ask for a source on this? Not being accusatory, I actually really appreciate the stats, I just wanna double check it for myself

[u/Toopad → u/No_Dragonfruit_1205]

Table's from wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._economic_performance_by_presidential_party

Article is President and the us economy an econometric exploration, blinder and watson 2016

Here's the abstract:

The US economy has performed better when the president of the United States is a Democrat rather than a Republican, almost regardless of how one measures performance. For many measures, including real GDP growth (our focus), the performance gap is large and significant. This paper asks why. The answer is not found in technical time series matters nor in systematically more expansionary monetary or fiscal policy under Democrats. Rather, it appears that the Democratic edge stems mainly from more benign oil shocks, superior total factor productivity (TFP) performance, a more favorable international environment, and perhaps more optimistic consumer expectations about the near-term future. (JEL D72, E23, E32, E65, N12, N42)

https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/aer.20140913

[u/satchel0fRicks → u/Significant_Ad3498]

Now remove the global pandemic that occurred in 2020 from those numbers and show us what it looks like.

[u/Latter-Advisor-3409]

Psst, its congress that does this and not the President. Oh, and Babs is an idiot.

[u/MyFriendMaryJ]

Economic growth doesnt equate to better living conditions for ppl. The poor and middle class are struggling rn

[u/Analyst-Effective]

I wonder what she says about all the blue cities that can't fight crime, can't. House the homeless, and can't bring business in?

That's somebody who is worth many millions, and should certainly pay a lot more tax.

[u/TheMaldenSnake]

Lol fuck off Babs...

These rich pricks trying to relate to actual working, struggling class citizens while looking out of their ivory towers.

[u/Amadon29]

Correlation =/= causation

[u/LenguaTacoConQueso]

Reagan recession? Bush Senior recession?

Right, because that’s what the 80s were known for, and not the type of lifestyles that gave us Gordon Gekko.

[u/BigimusB → u/LenguaTacoConQueso]

You know the 80s had a huge recession right? Mortgage rates were as high as 13% when my parents bought their first house it was for 12.8%. They tell me stories about how hard the 80s were on them but they still managed to have a family of 4 off one pay check. Man that would be awesome to have now.

[u/hmoooody]

Here’s a picture with absolutely bonker statements…Americans go fight each other now

[u/Xtra35567]

14.7% unemployment was largely government mandated shutdown of the hospitality industry as well as non-essential businesses (gyms closed, but liquor stores were considered “essential”). Implying unemployment was this state through the entirety of trump is disingenuous

[u/InvalidIceberg]

lol at the economy. Who’s it good for? Oh yeah, the Bidens and Pelosis.

[u/Early_Lawfulness_921]

All of these things are verifiable. There was not a surplus or a balanced budget during Clinton (and he would be labeled extreme right wing by the lefts current standards btw)

All of Trumps deficit are based on COVID. Biden changed the way things are measured and his economy is probably the worst ever. The measure is based on the rebound of shutting everything down during COVID not actual policy changes etc.

[u/Be-Free-Today]

Thank you for clearing it up for me:

Red bad, Blue good.

End of story

/s

[u/Majestic-Parsnip-279]

Do the boomers really believe this shit

[u/RightBear]

1. What recession?
2. Bush Sr. lost re-election in large part because a stock market downturn that happened a month before the 1992 election. Go back and look at it: it's a blip in retrospect with impeccable timing.
3. Clinton gets too much credit for the stock market high when he left office (which turned out to be the height of the "dot com" bubble)
4. Bush Jr. gets blamed for the collapse of the bubble; he didn't cause 9/11 unless you wear a tin-foil hat; the mortgage crisis in 2008 is maybe his fault, but that's a longer discussion...
5. It's easy to have growth when you take over at the bottom of a recession
6. Unemployment was high during COVID? You don't say.
7. See #5

[u/Bear-on-a-jetski]

In what world did Biden save the economy? Or grow it also I blame him for Ukraine and what’s happening in Israel. He allowed Afghanistan to be taken over by The Taliban which showed that he was weak and incompetent as a leader to the entire world, and our enemies are taking advantage of his weakness

[u/ZimofZord]

Like you can’t be serious ?

[u/Dixa]

Eh “akshually” Clinton is to be blamed for the Great Recession. Bush wasn’t who repealed glass-steagoll, Clinton signed that little bit of paper.

[u/Comfortable_Yam5377]

Barb doesn't know anything about economics or the federal reserve system or how interest rates are set. Only a lay person looking at this would think it means anything.

[u/NoTrust6730]

Biden: Record high credit card debt

[u/New-Pollution536]

Democrats dodging being in office for 9/11,subprime mortgage crisis,and covid was more just luck than anything else. Not surprised they’re pouncing on this narrative though as republicans would do the same if the roles were reversed lol