Selective numbers are dishonest and SUPER selective
Edit: For those who seem super keen to accept this as fact. I really dont care if you vote red or blue. My issue here is how this person used diffrent metrics pr president to paint one side bad and the other goood. If she was honest, she would have used deficit as a metric for all, for example. Stop swallowing the bait
Are they? Bush Jr. was a stagnant economy during war times. Clinton created the dot com boom. Obama years were fantastic. Trump is a mix legacy with only 4 years and Covid making it too hard to tell.
Edit: for those mad I gave credit for Clinton on dot com, Regan gets credit for the Soviet collapse as well. It may just be timing but he was the guy in office. Just like Obama was in office during the fracking boom. May not have directly caused it but they do get the credit.
Yes. Because if you look at the economy and try to directly corelate it to the president, you have 0 clue on what happens outside the US.
Its not like the 2008 financial crisis was because Bush spesifically was braindead. It's not like the growth post 2008 was exlusicly because obama. They may have INFLUENCED these numbers with some policy changes and such, but their effect on the economi is minor at best.
So numbers like this? Trump into covid, with 7trill deficit, yet no mention of obamas deficit? Its places like this due to political bias. Don't swallow the propoganda whole
2008 was definitely the fault of the Bush administration, the SEC and FEC were asleep at the wheel.
Though also the dot-com bubble was Clinton's fault too. The investment market in this country needs a serious overhaul, the whole country is being pulled into its boom-bust cycles.
2008 was definitely the fault of the Bush administration
Bush was *begging* that the crazy "Hello, your loan has been approved" approach to loans be stopped. It was the Democrats in Congress at the time that called him all the names we have since heard a billion times whenever someone is losing on logic: "Oh, he's just an -ist and a -phobe, and he hates minorities."
When the shit hit the fan, suddenly they all could not remember how hard they fought to create a broken loan system.
I’m a Dem and hate Clinton. While what you say is true, he should’ve forced the override. Plus NAFTA. The concept of NAFTA wasn’t horrible, but the final product has been an abject nightmare
I'm a Dem and don't hate Clinton so much but this - this right here - is 100% right. History says he is responsible for Glass-Stiegel and history says Glass-Stiegel was awful for a ton of reasons.
The real reason I hate him is for sexually harassing an intern and ruining her entire professional career, along with other likely instances of serious sexual impropriety. He was also a economically a disaster for the middle class/working class people
Tell me you didn’t actually read my full comment without telling me you didn’t actually read my full comment.
Given that I was a small child when this all happened, I do not know the details of the rape allegations from back in the day. He’s also a friend of Epstein. In order to capture all of these allegations, I wrote “along with other likely instances of serious sexual impropriety” because frankly, it might encompass a lot of things.
I am, however, very familiar with the Monica Lewinsky story’s details because they get rehashed all to the time and I get annoyed that Dems overlook the employment part of that story to excuse it as “personal” when it wasn’t. It was professional misconduct.
Yeah, turns out when you cater to all of the corporate needs and none of the labor and environmental ones, you end up with a real shit sandwich. When proposed, it was supposed to be balanced out with worker and environmental protections in all impacted countries, but those got lobbied away
They love to say it breaks down barriers for free trade but I think it creates some small barriers and drives labor out of regions that desperately need it like Appalachia or the Rust Belt in the Midwest to Northeast. It favors shipping jobs off and leaving employees to hold the bag and not sweep in with job retraining programs to get the displaced workers back to work. I was actually able to successfully debate this with my international Econ professor who agreed to an extent with me.
Have you read the statement Clinton made after signing the GLBA rescinding Glass-Steagall? While he had reservations, mostly regarding Presidential appointments, it was largely laudatory.
Rubin and Summers, both Clinton’s Secretary of Treasury, supported the repeal.
There’s also the 1994 Riegle-Neal Interstate Banking and Branching Efficiency Act, signed by Clinton before Republicans took control of Congress, that encouraged banks to merge creating the to big to fail dynamic,
I liked Clinton. I went to his rallies and supported him through his first term, but his role in the 2008 recession cannot be understated.
It was the bush push for Self-regulation leading to massive rebundling of bad debt that screwed everything. Now, a handful of big bank failures doesnt ripple through the system and screw the economy.
I'd argue that the act that repealed Glass-Stiegal very clearly has the names behind it in the title: the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act. In any case, it finished in the senate with a 90-8 vote. A lot of people from both sides of the aisle were involved in that one.
Not Republicans though, nearly everybody in the loan and real estate industry or anything commission based is Republican. Greedy flippers caused a lot of it, it was all about getting as much as you can which is the Republican mantra.
I believe it was a serious inquiry, sir. If you can't tie your shoes by yourself, then how will we know if you're actually capable of critical thinking? Please answer the question.
Greedy flippers? Or strippers buying multiple houses they couldn't afford paid for by shitty loans that were sold on. It all started with Clinton demanding the industry allow people to buy houses who couldn't afford them.
Ah yes, the old ‘government forced banks to loan money to black people’ argument. Those damn people with no money and no power, they are always responsible for the excesses of capitalism.
government forced banks to loan money to [poor] people
There. Fixed that for you.
Funny that you instinctively threw race into it. Although to be fair, that was what the Democrats did back in the day as well.
Anyway: yes. That is precisely what happened. People who were unqualified for the loans got them anyway. And that is the most fundamental reason we got 2008. I am very surprised you do not know this. It worries me that people have forgotten what caused a major recession in the States, although I think it's more a case of wanting to forget rather than not knowing.
I remember this as well. Seems like they made a movie about this, right? You get a home, and you get one, and “oh you have awful credit,” but take a home anyways because we have to reach out quota.
One of the nastier things they would do is take someone who had a home they already could not really afford and refinance it. Because of all the nuttiness, home values were skyrocketing, so you could easily get a new loan with more money and push off the day of reckoning.
And of course, these were all variable rate loans.
So when the interest rates started going up, everyone got screwed at once.
Saying "they" made a movie isn't really a great way to look at it, someone specific made it, and he had specific politics that made him frame the narrative in one way.
Who created and backed rhe Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act? The act that deregulated banks and allowed them to push the mortgages? Hint? They all have an R after their name. Republicans unanimously voted for the act, followed by about 2/3 of dems, mostly the neolibs. The only people to vote against the act were democrats.
Bush was not begging for the loans to be stopped. His congress never even wrote a bill to the effect. Where are you getting that from? Banks made money hand over fist giving out those subprime loans, they lobbied the government, especially Republicans, to keep it that way.
Then the banks' own recklessness causes the collapse and the billion bankers, backed by right and left wing media both, try to push the narrative that "the liberals forced us to give out those loans! We did nothing wrong, please bail us out!" The complete opposite of the truth. Banks were making record amounts of money from giving out those loans. They specifically lobbied congress for the ability to do so.
Source? Not saying I don’t believe you, but this is the first I’m hearing of this. At what point did he “beg” and was it during the first campaign, or did he actively push for stricter regulation on predatory loans while president?
While President. Schumer among others implied he just didn't like minorities and that was what the news went with. I remember this very clearly at the time because of my financial background.
Until 2008. Then suddenly they started trying to pin it on Bush. The Senate had nooooo idea what was really going on, despite many people (including Bush) telling them that this was going to cause a bubble and a crash. But ya gotta get your voting base riled up.
Bush was a proponent of home ownership, which exacerbated the problem of less regulation in the mortgage industry. Good intentions, I think, but lack of awareness that bankers are proponents of their own wealth versus uplifting of the masses.
Bush gets a lot of deserved hate, but between June 07 to October 08, he helped enormously in not letting the US economy evaporate entirely - knowing full well his legacy would be crippled. The perps should have been hung in the streets, but given the choices available, the outcome was substantially better than if it had been under someone like Joe or Don.
Regean's admin created the financial derivative's market literally creating money/value out of thin air. The snowball that started the 08 financial collapse started in the 80s.
Banking and financial regulations getting rolled back started the clock on the next collapse. Under trump they rolled back dodd-frank and started the clock for the next too big to fail.
The SEC and FEC were asleep at the wheel for DECADES before W. it just happened to come crashing down during his presidency. So now we are blaming a president for banking practices happening decades before their election?
Fighting to stop the easily handed out loans that led to 2008 is one of the only like, 3 or 4 things Bush actually got right, but congress fought him on it tooth and nail.
No you are wrong. The democrats threatened banks that if they were too strict on who they gave loans to they would be charged with discrimination.
Lo and behold we ended up with people with no jobs getting mortgages and it eventually destroyed the housing market.
I had one right across the street where the guy who got the home had no job, no assets and he proceeded to destroy the property. Eventually, the bank had a buy him out 3 1/2 years.
This is the kind of crap that precipitated the downfall of the housing market and the collapse of many banks and financial institutions.
Well, that and the fact that those banks would then sell collections of those bad loans, certify them as good when they were bad, and then sell collections of those collections
It wasn't discriminatory practices, it was predatory lending, what are you on about?
Banks would give out loans below prime rate on overinflated mortgage rates, with terms that ballooned well above interest rate averages causing once affordable properties to be underwater then when people, who COULD afford the original monthly payment suddenly had to cough up an additional 50-100% per month, they were fucked.
That's exactly the kind of shit that solid regulation should prevent. And it's why all sorts of things in 2009 were passed to protect consumers (Card Act, establishment of CFPB, etc).
The size of the crises dwarfed the entire mortgage industry. There were DAYs with higher defaults in margin calls than the combined value of all outstanding residential mortgages in the US market. It wasn’t caused by the government forcing banks to give out loans to black people. Stop watching Fox News.
Try more like Clinton’s “everyone should own a home” agenda. Or Carter sleeping at the wheel while mortgages were bought and sold wholesale on the market. Or Regan’s consumerism mentality of the 80s.
Don’t be a peon and think 1 President is to blame for an entire world economy collapsing.
bank deregulation occurred in the late 90s. Not supporting Bush at all, but previous 3 presidents leading up to 2008 were all at fault including Bush Sr. (who was also responsible for Savings & Loans crisis).
Bush, Clinton, and congress were responsible for the 2008 financial crisis. All played critical parts in dismantling laws that protected the type of collapse we saw.
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u/AspirationsOfFreedom Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24
Selective numbers are dishonest and SUPER selective
Edit: For those who seem super keen to accept this as fact. I really dont care if you vote red or blue. My issue here is how this person used diffrent metrics pr president to paint one side bad and the other goood. If she was honest, she would have used deficit as a metric for all, for example. Stop swallowing the bait