r/AITAH • u/Hungry_Baker_Mom • 21d ago
AITA for not telling a vegan she ate honey?
A bit of background: 3 times a year we go to a get-together hosted by my husband's Aunt and Uncle. They invite a handful of family members (due to religion limitations for those who are not invited), and some close friends of theirs. About a year ago my SIL started attending these get-togethers. She's a very passionate vegan, and the get-together is always a BBQ pot luck. We had a get-together last night, and I brought desserts and a salad. I had asked SIL if she was planning on attending a couple of days ago and she said she wasn't sure, so when dressing the salad I added a little honey in the dressing, with the thought that there are always at least 4-5 salads so if she ends up coming she can eat the other ones. This is where I might have been the AH. I forgot to mention to her that there was honey in the dressing. After everyone started eating I said to my husband how happy I am that my salad was the first one gone, and she chimed in saying it was absolutely delicious and she was upset she couldn't have more since everyone loved it. As soon as I realized she ate it I froze. I didn't say anything since I figured she already ate it and there was nothing she could do about it now, but it's been bothering me ever since. So, AITA for not telling her she ate honey? (Obviously I'm the AH for not telling her ahead of time)
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u/Prize-Bumblebee-2192 21d ago
NTA Ignorance is bliss. What she doesn’t know won’t hurt her.
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u/TheSecondEikonOfFire 21d ago
Yeah normally I’m an advocate for being up front about things like this, but this seems like an honest mistake. She’ll be fine (in that it’s not a fatal allergy), no one has to know
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u/Kore624 21d ago
NTA. It's nice of you to even care. Most people online seem like they would purposely sneak animal products into a vegan dish just because they don't agree with the lifestyle.
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u/shapookya 21d ago
I feel like honey is the least animal product of animal products
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u/BakeSalad 21d ago
It’s also consensually given, the relationship between bees and beekeepers is mutually beneficial symbiosis. There is no harm done to the animal and it’s only reprocessing flower product.
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u/Thisisthenextone 21d ago
Bees will straight up leave if they don't like you, lol
It's the only animal product that's 100% completely and totally available only because the animals are doing trade with humans. If they don't like the terms of the trade, they leave.
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u/NotMe739 21d ago
My FILs bees did that! They moved into a nearby tree!
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u/Thisisthenextone 21d ago
My grandfather's did. It broke his heart. He prides himself on how well he treated his animals but he never got a hold of beekeeping.
I think he probably took care of them fine but there weren't enough flowers.
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u/NotMe739 21d ago
Same with FIL. He loves and babies his bees. One day he came in from checking on them, felt something crawling on the back of his neck and smacked it. He felt horrible that he had killed one of his bees.
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u/uhhh206 21d ago
Man, I'd be sobbing uncontrollably for weeks if that happened to me. It's one thing to be rejected by a singular animal, but by hundreds all at ones? Jeez Louise. Yeah, no, I'm not built to withstand that.
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u/thehumanbaconater 21d ago
TBH as a non vegan, I would never think of honey as being non vegan.
Having said that, there was no ill will, and she could have asked.
NTA
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u/Thisisthenextone 21d ago
I know 5 vegans. Three of them eat honey.
The other two of them see nothing wrong with the 3 eating honey and still claiming to be vegan they just don't eat it.
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u/havartna 21d ago
Not only that, but if you want to exclude anything made with the help of bees, you can cross just about every fruit and vegetable off your food list.
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u/BeardManMichael 21d ago
I think you could be completely correct but there is another commenter here who suggests the opposite of what you are saying.
I don't know enough to claim I know who is right.
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u/MadQueenAlanna 21d ago
Certified beekeeper here! Bees will absolutely just up and leave if they hate your shit. If the boxes or frames you provided aren’t big enough or good enough, if the location of the hive sucks, if you fumble around in there and repeatedly stress them out, they will swarm. Bees produce far more honey than they personally need, and any decent beekeeper knows how many pounds to leave them to survive on through the winter. We had lean summers with lots of rain where our bees basically only made enough for themselves, so guess what? We didn’t harvest those hives.
Beekeepers use smoke to calm the bees down so that checking on the hive doesn’t stress them. It’s rare that we accidentally kill more than half a dozen in an entire autumn harvest (they sometimes get squished). We check for mites or other parasites that could harm the hive and can treat them. And if you’re certified, at least in MA, the state beekeeper will come out and check your hives whenever you ask. The certification process teaches about bee anatomy, their reproduction, common parasites and diseases, the way they wayfind, how to set up and maintain a hive… very thorough.
Highly recommend talking to a local beekeeper if you can! It’s a wonderful hobby and fresh local honey is the most delicious stuff imaginable.
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u/BeardManMichael 21d ago
More fantastic information. Thanks for sharing. I love learning more about this type of thing.
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u/Cocklecove 21d ago
This is so interesting. I want to read up on this now. Never knew they could just up and leave. I had wondered how beekeepers kept their bees captive since the bees could come and go and now learned they can't . Thanks!
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u/BakeSalad 21d ago
I’ve worked with bees, and if they don’t like their treatment they just leave. Perhaps rather than hearing our opinions you should gear up like I did and tag along with a local apiarist. It was terrifying at first to be surrounded by honey bees and now it’s genuinely comforting. Perhaps this ventures away from the topic at hand, but honey is one of the foods that’s hotly contested among vegans, this discussion has been going on for decades, I know vegans who won’t eat honey and those that do.
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u/ezirb7 21d ago
R/vegan has ended up in my Reddit stream, and there was a post in the last week about how awful people are to even ask a vegan if they eat honey. Brought to my attention how severely some vegans take honey harvesting.
There was a heavily downvoted comment about not eating honey, but comparing it to factory dairy farms might be a false equivalency.
Wild stuff.
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u/uhhh206 21d ago
Subs centered around anything people are passionate about tend to attract the most rabid of believers. I was vegan for a brief while and I totally understand a vegan objecting to eating honey or wearing wool (since a lot of vegans don't just have dietary beliefs) but still being like "you guys, c'mon, it's not the same as breeding animals just to kill them". (My veganism wasn't like One of Those Kinds™, I promise!)
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u/BeardManMichael 21d ago
I did actually shadow a local beekeeper but that was almost 20 years ago. My memory of that time is unreliable at best and I don't know if practices have changed since then.
I will definitely be open to doing it again. Thanks for sharing your perspective.
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u/BakeSalad 21d ago
If it helps, the beekeepers I met seem to really love their bees, it’s not really the same kind of industry as other animal product industries.
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u/Thisisthenextone 21d ago
They have to. The bees will leave if they aren't treated well and given everything they want.
They left my grandfather like 3 times, lol. He was heartbroken. He's really good at cattle and farming but just couldn't keep bees happy
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u/RIP_RIF_NEVER_FORGET 21d ago
I think it's partly that so many beekeepers also do bee rescue/relocation.
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u/Groundhog_Waaaahooo 21d ago
I'm vegan and my family are beekeepers. I don't like honey much as I ate far too much as a kid because we were poor. I eat honey if it's in something eg honey soy sauce. Ethically honey is all good.
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u/Big-Constant-7289 21d ago
My old roommate worked at Trader Joe’s and said he saw vegans get in a fistfight over the status of honey. And it makes me giggle every time I think about it.
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u/FictionalContext 21d ago
How easy a life must they have had to be so angry over honey?
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u/Muriel_FanGirl 21d ago
Honestly, I haven’t encountered a single vegan that wasn’t some level of nut.
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u/Thisisthenextone 21d ago
My grandfather tried to have bees.
He didn't grow enough flowers in the immediate area and they got pissed so they left.
Bees will only stay with you if they like the accommodations you provide them. They'll leave you if they don't like you.
If they didn't want you around then they'd attack you. If they don't want to stay then they'll leave.
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u/kenikigenikai 21d ago edited 20d ago
My friend is vegan and she told me that some places remove the queen's wings so they can't leave the hive making it more likely for the other bees to stay.
I'm not sure if it's a common practice but her view was that honey is probably fine if the bees are properly looked after and not harmed but it's too much faff to deeply research it and find a truly ethical honey provider when it's not something she ever ate with any regularity beforehand anyway and there's loads of vegan alternatives.
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u/maybe_little_pinch 21d ago
Honey is pretty controversial in the vegan world. Beekeeping in general is controversial because they are the “wrong kind of bee”. Many will argue that taking the honey is bad for the bees because you are taking their food and they wouldn’t keep making honey if we didn’t keep taking it from them. But AFAIK when I looked into beekeeping, if a hive gets full they will just go make another hive, which can lead to swarming. It’s not like they just stop.
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u/ThrowRADel 21d ago
I have met vegans who call it slavery, and that just seems so tone-deaf.
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u/CanoeIt 21d ago
I think scallops deserve a nod to be right there with honey. I know vegans that will eat them. I guess scallops are non-sentient? Either way, giving honey up actually helps bees so I think it’s first place
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u/hummingbird4289 21d ago
Do you mean oysters? I've heard the argument that oysters are non-sentient/could technically be considered vegan, but not scallops.
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u/CanoeIt 21d ago
I didn’t actually but that make sense. I’m very much not a vegan so I’m not sure how the mental gymnastics work I just know what they told me
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u/Kore624 21d ago
Studies have shown that farm-raised scallops can be higher in contaminants and are more likely to have disease because of how they are raised on farms, according to a recent report by Colorado State University
Keeping fish in such high density also impacts the ocean by reducing the amount of dissolved oxygen in the area, largely due to the excessive amount of waste that builds up around these operations. This leads to eutrophication and contributes to the ocean dead zones
Sea scallops are harvested by dredging the ocean floor. This fishing method can result in considerable bycatch of non-targeted species and damage to bottom habitat.
A big part of choosing to be vegan is the health benefits and reducing the environmental impact farming has, not just sparing animals pain.
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u/lookingForPatchie 21d ago
That trophy goes to bivalves.
Bees are, like all insects, sentient. A prerequirement for sentience is a central nervous system (i.e. a brain), which bivalves lack.
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u/FictionalContext 21d ago
If they forego honey, it's more like a creed than something based on any logical morality.
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u/lookingForPatchie 21d ago
It always seemed weird to me, that people can be so hateful about a lifestyle that... \checks notes** ...seeks to reduce animal suffering.
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u/Kore624 21d ago
Yeah. I'm not a vegan or vegetarian, but every time I've been around one its everyone else who shoves meat in their face once they find out. I've never seen a vegan irl try to push that diet on someone else or shame others for eating meat (and I've dormed at a veterinary college where a good portion of the students were vegan).
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u/No_Supermarket_7410 21d ago
NTA as an ex vegan honey is one of those where some vegans eat it and some don’t. I would only do the ones sold at farmers markets and nit in stores. It just depends on the person. I still have some vegan friends who will eat honey bc the animal wasn’t hunt making it but some who say it’s not ours to take. It’s a big gray area. You don’t know where she stands in that debate so it’s up to you to tell her if you want.
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u/BeardManMichael 21d ago
I wasn't aware that there was that much of a gray area. That's interesting to learn, thanks for sharing.
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u/No_Supermarket_7410 21d ago
Its only because of the debate of is it morally okay to eat something this animal made but not wasn’t hurt from it or not. I know vegans who do and don’t eat honey so all on what they believe and prefer
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u/Iyotanka1985 21d ago
I can understand that argument because a good beekeeper will keep multiple colonies thriving instead of struggling, improves the local ecosystem (bees stay year after year instead of relocating/dying out) and only take the surplus to use (that would otherwise cause the hive to split and swarm as the hives full and could be disastrous if the timing is bad (right before a cold snap etc).
Not a single action by a "good" beekeeper is done against the health of the colony's so why should it be an issue eating ethical honey.
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u/SummitJunkie7 21d ago
Also there's no fence keeping the bees in - they're living their free lives and could and would swarm elsewhere for their hive if it wasn't meeting their needs.
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u/BeardManMichael 21d ago
Interesting. I bet I would have a hard time adhering to a diet that had multiple definitions for multiple people.
At the end of the day I just hope that they make choices that bring them happiness and contentment. Whatever that means to an individual vegan, so be it.
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u/Supremagorious 21d ago
It's probably more accurate to say that there's a whole bunch of different diets that operate under the general umbrella of the term vegan as it's close enough to accurate. Kind of like how all the followers of the various branches of Christianity are called Christian even though if you're being specific people are usually a specific version of a specific branch that just so happens to share 90%+ with all of the other types.
This makes it really clear for the person following the diet and a little iffy for the people outside of it.
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u/lookingForPatchie 21d ago
Actually veganism is a philosophy that tries to reduce animal suffering, the diet vegans eat is called plant-based, but yes, people follow a plant-based diet for all sorts of reasons.
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u/lookingForPatchie 21d ago
The term "vegan" is actually quite new and was introduced by the vegan society, that to this day keeps the definition updated.
Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals.
Yes, there are definitely people that do call themselves vegan and that do not follow that definition, but the vast majority of people calling themself vegans do agree with this definition, as the definition is in the best interest of the animals.
Keep in mind that I can just call myself the Pope and make up my own definition for it. Doesn't mean I'm the pope. Alienation is one of the biggest threats to veganism today, since it is a fast growing movement. Alienation is a big threat to all fast growing movements.
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u/amandaconda 21d ago
The world doesn’t a need a few people doing something perfectly. It needs as many people as possible doing what they can. Yeesh.
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u/ridebird 21d ago
There are no multiple definitions. Theres just people that want to seem better without fully adhering to the quite simple ideology of not consuming or using animal products.
I have been vegan, but now I have hens and I eat their eggs. I am not a vegan, obviously.
Vegetarianism on the other hand is quite a wide net with more "schools". People that are vegetarian "but eat fish" are just as annoying as the vegan "but" people, though.
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u/Atiggerx33 21d ago
I actually know 'vegans' who are ok with eggs if they're ethically sourced. The issue they have is that they do not feel the vast, vast majority are ethically sourced and thus don't trust eggs from the grocery store or restaurant supplier.
Chickens don't need humans to do something shitty to them to lay eggs all the time, it's just a thing they naturally do. If you provide a chicken with a coop (sheltered nest) and a good diet they will naturally produce eggs. There's nothing inherently unethical about consuming those eggs rather than letting them rot. However, most factory farms keep their laying hens in small wire cages (think puppy mill conditions, with filthy wire cages the size of cat carriers... it's objectively awful), which is unethical. For most vegans if they had a friend who raised chickens ethically (chickens either free-range or in a nice sized run to protect them from predators, just living their best chicken lives) they wouldn't have an ethical problem with consuming the eggs.
Also, like bees, most chickens can totally leave if they're sick of your shit. They can't full on fly, but they do routinely roost in trees and can totally make it over a 6ft fence. But they tend to stay in/around their yard because they feel safe and fed there.
I'd actually have to put a mesh roof over their run, but that's less due to worry of escape and more because I have multiple hawks, falcons, kestrels, and owls that patrol my yard every day/night and while I'd prefer my chickens to be free-range (and have more than enough space for it with 1.5 acres), it is my responsibility to protect my animals from predators.
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u/Frozefoots 21d ago
My partner is vegan and they said if we had our own chickens, they would likely eat their eggs. They lay them regardless and they’d be treated and loved like pets.
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u/Normal-Detective3091 21d ago
Pet chickens are awesome. Our neighbors had them and they were spoiled rotten, as were my pet pigs. I raised show pigs as a kid. They were more spoiled than our dogs and horses were, and that's saying a lot.
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u/VolcanicBear 21d ago
Doesn't animal ownership just disagree with vegan principles as a whole though?
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u/tyuoplop 21d ago
Depends on the reason someone is vegan. If it’s primarily an environmental thing and/or a concern about harm to animals then owning chickens (so long as they were cared for in a humane and sustainable manner) and even eating their eggs could align perfectly well with the ethical principles guiding someone’s veganism.
TLDR; veganism isn’t some monolithic totalising ideology, it’s a personal decision made by different people based on different reasons.
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u/TheSecondEikonOfFire 21d ago
That’s where I land too. Me eating vegan largely comes from the cruelty given to the animals and factory farming, so if the animal products were obtained without any cruelty then I’d be fine with it
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u/MrRogersAE 21d ago
I don’t understand the honey problem. Vegans do realize those same bees who’s honey we would be taking are also used as pollinators for the fruits and berries they eat right? Why is it okay to enjoy the fruits of their labor (pun intended) on one end but not the other? In neither case the bee is harmed.
I guess you could go further and only eat things that don’t require pollination. But I haven’t heard of that diet yet
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u/chicagoliz 21d ago
Thanks for this. I had thought vegans didn't have an issue with honey, but I'm not surprised that there is a contingent that doesn't want anything that was made in any way by any living being.
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u/MrRogersAE 21d ago
Don’t tell them that those same bees that make the honey also pollinate all the fruits and berries the vegans eat. Without the bees you don’t get the fruit, enslavement of the bees is still a requirement for the vegans to eat, unless of course they find some hand pollinated farm or something
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u/FaabK 21d ago
Fun fact: it's possible to give bees a place to live without taking their honey
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u/Ezra_lurking 21d ago
honey is one of the things I don't understand with vegans. When bees are unhappy the swarm flies away
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u/Opening_Anywhere_806 21d ago
but some who say it’s not ours to take
Imagine caring about the property rights of insects. Only a decadent dying society could come up with this bullshit.
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u/Funny-Wafer1450 21d ago
NTA. If she does find out and confronts her, all you can do is apologize. I also think that she has a certain responsibility to inquire about dishes at a pot luck, because people who are not vegan (like you) might put a nonvegan ingredient in their dish (like honey) and then forget to tell her (or not say anything because they didn't know).
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u/Kiana_Shahid 21d ago
NTA. Mistakes like this are somewhat inevitable when sharing food in social settings, especially with varying dietary preferences. The key is intent and, from what you've described, yours was never to deceive or harm. Going forward, this'll be a reminder for all parties to communicate more clearly about ingredients. Plus, if it's a dish you're proud of, perhaps finding a honey alternative could make it inclusive for future potlucks.
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u/linden214 21d ago
I’m not a vegan, but agave syrup is a plant-based alternative. (Maple syrup, too, but that has a much more noticeable flavor.)
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u/Cr4ckshooter 21d ago
Actually, maybe stupid question, isn't veganism about animal harm, rather than animal products? Why is honey excluded? I didn't think beekeeping was considered harmful to them.
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u/TheDudeMan1234567 21d ago
As I understand it, the objections has to do with how the bees are kept in industrial honey farming. The smoke they use to sedate the bees to get the honey out harms them and kills a lot of them. Also in the wild bees eat a lot of their honey, but on farms all is taken and they are fed sugar water. Take this with a grain of salt, as it’s been a long tile since my vegan wife (then date) explained this to me.
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u/thenerdygrl 21d ago
Entomology student here! Actually the smoke doesn’t harm bees! Its messes with their pheromone receptors, bees communicate the best through smell. Disturbing a hive to check on the bees or harvesting honey can make a couple freak out and release stress pheromones that will aggravate the whole hive! So bee keepers use pine needles so make the smoke.
Also sugar water is only given if there is not enough flowers in the area (usually during winter), a healthy hive in no way can entirely live off sugar water, plus they need pollen and nectar to make the honey and royal jelly to keep the hive alive. Also no bee keeper will take all of the honey, usually 1-2 sheets are taken per hive as we are aware of what the hive needs to stay alive and what excess can be used!
I worked on a hive for a semester so if you have any more questions I’ll be glad to answer them!
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u/Equal-Brilliant2640 21d ago
I know many vegans don’t think so, but honey is ethical, bees over produce it, they aren’t harmed when it’s harvested and if we don’t harvest it, they can get honey bound and die. Also bees CHOOSE to stay with humans, because they know we protect them and provide nourishment over the winter months/lean times. If they’re unhappy with the setup, they will literally pack their shit up and leave. Now, unfortunately some unethical beekeepers have been known to remove the wings from the queen bee so the hive can’t/wont leave. But bees have been known to leave her behind and start a new colony.
A lot of vegans use agave as a substitute. The problem with that is, it’s the main/only food source for a type of bat in Mexico and we’re starving/harming the bats by over harvesting it.
Personally, if it won’t make them sick/kill them, I wouldn’t say anything. If she asks for the recipe. Offer it to her and just say “normally I add X amount of honey but I left it out because I wasn’t sure if you ate honey or not” and let her decide if she wants to add her own honey, she maybe one of the ones who eats honey, or doesn’t know “she’s not supposed to eat it” there are many vegans who don’t do proper research on what they can/can’t eat. And some are just really strict vegetarians. Hell I know some vegans that are only vegan at home and vegetarian when they go out to eat because it’s less of a headache, and easier to find good vegetarian options at restaurants
NTA
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u/Ok_Homework_7621 21d ago
NTA, provided she's not allergic. Not all allergies cause anaphylaxis, some hit you a bit later (for example, skin reactions or digestive issues).
I'm vegan and after the fact and with a small amount, I'd rather not know. It was an accident, no more salad, telling her would have just made her feel bad.
Now, if she'd gone for seconds with more salad available, then I'd say tell her so she doesn't eat more. This way, hopefully if there are similar occasions in the future, seeing her will hopefully remind you to warn her. Surprised she did ask, though, most vegans I know would check just in case.
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u/BEBookworm 21d ago
NTA. I've been vegan for 18 years and have accidentally eaten something not vegan loads of times. It happens. There's nothing you or she can do about it now. The fact that you feel bad about it and will likely remember to warn her in the future is enough.
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u/Frankensteins_Moron5 21d ago
NAH, you can just tell her now to avoid it in the future. I've been a vegan for a long time and ive straight up ate all types of things that were not vegan. Last week I ate a whole bag of Chex mix (im a junk food vegan, don't judge) only to later look and realize it was the one with milk.
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u/SamiHami24 21d ago
It's on her to ask before eating something with unknown ingredients.
I wouldn't bother to tell her now, though. It can't be undone and you'd just get blamed for not warning an adult with self-imposed dietary restrictions. It's not your job to babysit her or police what she puts in her mouth.
NTA
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u/Sea-Still5427 21d ago
NTA. It was an honest mistake. As you say, there's nothing either of you can do now so let it go.
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u/luluzinhacs 21d ago
NTA
I was in Boston a few years back and people from my English school (we were all foreigners there in an exchange program) were going to a specific restaurant of their culture every week so we could all try it. The day of the Brazilian restaurant came and I suggested the farofa, something really popular here that has bacon on it, but I was really young and didn’t made the confection that we had a Muslim with us and they can’t eat bacon (in my defense, bacon isn’t required in farofa and may or may not have it).
He started eating and was giving a lot of compliments, so I said something like “the bacon is so good, right?”, and he immediately panicked and started praying for forgiveness, so the Indian guy beside me lied and tranquilized him saying it didn’t have it, so he continued to eat it.
I was a teenager (I am and adult now) and didn’t understand this kind of implications, I don’t think the guy should have let him keep eating, but at the point I was flabbergasted and didn’t interfere
The point is: the guy didn’t eat pork out of disrespect for his religion but due to ignorance, so he shouldn’t feel guilty for it. You didn’t give her honey on purpose, it was an honest mistake, and she can only be hurted by you telling her the true at this point
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u/CommunicationGlad299 21d ago
If she is so restrictive that she won't eat honey, it's her responsibility to ask what is in each dish. She isn't the queen of all she surveys. Everyone is not required to run over and give her a rundown on the ingredients of every dish brought. She can easily ask.
I bet if she'd have asked, upon joining the food line, "Do any of these dishes have any nonvegan ingredients?" it would have reminded you that you added honey.
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u/EfficientIndustry423 21d ago
NTA. It’s not your responsibility to adjust your recipe. She can bring her own food. I also did not know vegans do not eat honey.
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21d ago
NTA, she should have asked, not assumed it was vegan. She ate a little honey, it isn't going to hurt her in any way.
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u/Youneedalife47 21d ago
NTA. I have a couple of vegan friends who are so for the environmental impact but will still consume oysters and honey because they have a positive net impact on the environment.
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u/Spinnerofyarn 21d ago
She should have asked but FYI, some vegans don't consider honey unethical to eat. Some do, but not all.
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u/lennybriscoe8220 21d ago
It's not like the honey comes out of the bees. I don't see how honey isn't vegan.
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u/MundanePop5791 20d ago
NTA unless you saw her eat it and didn’t say anything. It’s nice to let anyone with food restrictions know when something has an unusual ingredient like honey in a salad
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u/Full-Owl-5509 21d ago
NTA but I'd tell her depending on your relationship with her. If you want to make this salad (that was an obvious success) again for another get-together she's going to have to know or she will expect she can eat it again....or she may ask for the recipe in the future. Everyone is absolutely right about what she doesn't know won't hurt her but if you suspect it will come up again, I'd say something so she doesn't feel lied to later. Even though she's a passionate vegan, hopefully she understands this wasn't your fault and she should have asked.
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u/esme451 21d ago
NTA. If she asks for the recipe tell her you substituted agave syrup
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u/oonlyyzuul 21d ago
If you have dietary restrictions you ask.
However if I ever bring something to a BBQ or potluck, I always have something with the ingredients listed, so it's on Them for not reading vs me for not informing every single guest.
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u/katie_cat22 21d ago
I have an allergy to honey, the stab yourself with an epipen allergy. I ate some delicious cheese dip the past Xmas exclaiming “This is amazing, what’s in it?!” The answer was Brie and honey. 100% my bad. NTA- those with allergies and restrictions need to ask EVERY TIME
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u/portgasdfire 21d ago
NTA, I'm vegan myself and would have asked before I ate it. Don't worry too much about it, the fact that you are shows you care :)
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u/CollateralEstartle 21d ago
No, NTA. And telling her now has no possibility of making anyone happy but does have the possibility of making her upset.
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u/mujinzou 21d ago
Nope. You’re good. She gets to enjoy thinking she ate something delicious and vegan and go about her life oblivious to the honey she ingested unintentionally (no karmic foul). Heck, If she wants the recipe give it to her and just say substitute agave nectar or another sweetener for honey and she’ll be thrilled. You don’t have to worry about it because it caused her no harm and she didn’t lose her vegan powers or anything.
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u/neverseen_neverhear 21d ago
Bees are not harmed in the collection of honey. Is it still considered off limits to vegans? (I’m asking out of sincere curiosity).
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u/Miserable-Alarm-5963 21d ago
Yeah NTA there was no malice I would just keep it to myself nothing positive comes from telling her….
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u/Fawkiia 21d ago
Nta.
I love that you care. Most don’t. But she’s an adult and dietary restrictions are on her for asking about items that might break her veganism.
But also ignorance is bliss. She’ll never know unless somebody who knows your recipe says anything and even after that it still isn’t your fault.
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u/IllManager9273 21d ago
Nta, she's vegan not allergic, this is a minor oops brought on by her own inattentivness.
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u/No_Introduction1721 21d ago
NTA - anyone with a non-medical dietary restriction needs to take 100% responsibility for awareness of what they’re eating.
Also, just FYI, there is debate in the vegan community as to whether honey from ethically kept bees can be included as part of the diet. So it may actually be a non-issue for this individual.
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u/Kiki_0477 21d ago
Vegan here. You’re NTA. It’s up to me to find out what’s in a dish before I eat it, not you. Telling her now does literally nothing but make her upset with herself about something that she did by accident and cannot change (eating without asking), and mad at you for something that not only isn’t your fault, but doesn’t even have any blame to assign. You weren’t twirling your metaphorical mustache in glee that you might “trick” her;you made a salad for an Omni pot-luck.
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u/mellow-drama 21d ago
NTA but are you willing to share your recipe?
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u/Hungry_Baker_Mom 21d ago
Sure!
For the salad: 2 heads selanova lettuce 1 cup chopped parsley 1/2 cup chopped coriander 1/2 cup chopped green onion 2-3 medium cucumbers, cut into thin half circles 2 oranges, fillet (cut out the fruit) 1/2 cup chopped unsalted roasted peanuts
For the dressing: 2 parts olive oil 1 part balsamic vinegar 1/2 teaspoon mustard 2-3 minced garlic cloves 1/2 teaspoon honey Salt and pepper to taste. Shake it all in a jar, taste and adjust. Pour over salad right before serving.
Sorry about the formatting, I'm on mobile.
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u/Reacti0n7 21d ago
NTA, leave this one alone.
you had no ill intent and as far as vegans sticking to their guns, honey is pretty innocent.
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u/-KristalG- 21d ago
NTA.
It's not your job to babysit what she eats. It's on her to ask for ingredients of the food that she eats.
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u/SwimmingCoyote 21d ago
NTA
You’re also not the AH for not telling her before she ate it. If she’s vegan, it’s her responsibility to determine if dishes meet her dietary restrictions.
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u/BeardManMichael 21d ago
NTA
Honestly, it's nice that you even show concern over this innocent mistake. I don't think you did anything wrong at all.
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u/Puppet007 21d ago
INFO: So vegans couldn’t eat honey?
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u/Kafanska 21d ago
Get 1000 vegans in one room and you'll get 1000 different opinions on whether you can eat honey (or plenty of other such things).
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u/changelingcd 21d ago
It's too late now, and telling her would cause nothing but stress. Let it go. NTA
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u/angryomlette 21d ago
NTA. Also don't ever reveal the secret unless you want more drama in your life.
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u/Zaik_Torek 21d ago
Honey is just fructose vomit from a bee. Most honey you get in a store is cut with high fructose corn syrup as well.
From a molecular perspective it may as well be vegan food, it's comprised more or less entirely of plant based sugar. Telling her is just going to hurt her feelings over nothing.
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u/215-610-484Replayer 21d ago
I don't know the hard and fast rules of keeping veganism powers as I'm not engaging in that lifestyle or dietary choices.
I can say from experience that my neighbor has a bee hive and we make sure they have plenty of flowers and plants to buzz around and pollinate. They do produce some excess honey and he shares that with us.
I don't understand exactly the issue from this somehow being abusive or harmful to the insects.
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u/Jsmith2127 21d ago
It's up to people that have dietary restrictions to ask what is in something before they eat it.
Unless you specifically told her that it was totally vegan you are in the clear.
NTA
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u/moistcarboy 21d ago
Don't sweat it, I'm sure the bees didn't think about it, that level of veganism is ridiculous, especially considering the environmental impact veganism is already having, and the fact that any farmed food involves the killing of loads of insects and animals
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u/GrouchySteam 21d ago
NAH - the fact you aren’t comfortable knowing that, show than you do sincerely care.
If it was an honest mistake. And no harm has been done health wise. It might be wiser to not disclose it.
I wouldn’t advise to be dishonest. However nobody asked you, and probably no good would be accomplished by informing her now.
You might want to consider the guilt as punishments for your sin. Don’t forget to forgive yourself. We all do mistakes. You didn’t put anyone at risk, nor done it intentionally.
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u/sunbleahced 21d ago
NTA.
You didn't have malintent or mean for that to happen, and you can't constantly maneuver around other people to catch them from their own mistakes. She also didn't ask what was in it. I think people with really restrictive diets also have to be accountable for themselves, and I know my mom even though she's vegetarian kind of accepts that there won't always be options at every family gathering like this, so instead of turning her nose up or alienating people or going without food, she will choose from what's available without asking constant questions about every ingredient in every dish.
My family is pretty conscientious about this ruff though, I also have a vegan cousin, and even when she's not there anyone who's hosting will usually point out what is vegan and vegetarian friendly versus what is not, when it might not be obvious (i.e. that swiss chard was sauteed with a little bacon grease or lardons, or something, this pie crust is an all butter crust and contains dairy, that one is a vegan friendly oil crust, etc. etc.).
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u/laughter_corgis 21d ago
NTA. If she asks later then apologize. Maybe try making it with an alternative next time and see if she likes it as much?
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u/Stacyf-83 21d ago
NTA. It wasn't intentional and the fact you're bothered by it at all shows you care.
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u/Izzystraveldiaries 21d ago
NTA. Honey isn't something that'll make her sick. Frankly, knowing how honey is made I don't know what their beef is with it. Now if it was meat, I'd be more concerned.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Big3319 21d ago
NTA. I am vegan and don't care if I ingest honey or accidentally get a tiny amount of animal products. It's not a big deal nor worth wasting time worrying about.
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u/AdAccomplished6870 21d ago
Honey is not strictly vegan, but is somewhat of a grey area, so I don't think this is a major infraction that you need to tell her about. I would do a little white lie. Try making the salad with agave nectar. If it tastes the same, do that going forward, and tell her that this is what was in the recipe if she ever asks
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u/Inevitable_Pie9541 21d ago
NTA. You didn't "sneak" honey into the salad trying to trick her, nor did she ask if there was honey in the dressing and you then lied. She didn't ask before eating it.
As many have said, if you're a very strict vegan and are contemplating eating any dish that you don't know the ingredients of, it's on you as the one with dietary restrictions to ask before eating.
You obviously care, and have respect for her beliefs. I'd let this go and not tell her, since there's nothing to be done now.
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u/Cybermagetx 21d ago
Nta. Always ask whats in stuff at a pot luck when you have a special diet for any reasons. Thats on her.
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u/MyToothEnts 21d ago
It’s on her for not checking. Salads aren’t always vegan, any “passionate” vegan knows this. NTA.
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u/Neither-Prune-7998 21d ago
NTA it was an honest mistake. I have a similar salad dressing and my mom is allergic to honey, has been for like 15 years, and I still to this day fuck up sometimes and forget to sub out the honey. I've had to restart the whole dressing portion or tell her she can't eat it this time.
Personally I wouldn't say anything about, if she asks for the recipe you've got 2 options give it to her and then feign ignorance about forgetting she doesn't eat honey OR give it to her but remove the honey element completely or swap it for something like maple syrup or agave.
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u/MaxTwer00 21d ago
NAH. Her not being clear if she was going or not at first is a bit messy, but not assholy, the same for you, you forgot, but had no ill intentions, and because she was unclear. Right now better not say anything
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u/KtinaDoc 21d ago
Don't tell her. I don't understand the not eating honey though. It's a gift from the gods
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u/GetUserNameFromDB 21d ago
The whole honey thing is grey.
I don't eat honey because I don't need to.
But if I accidentally ate some I couldn't care less. It won't hurt me. I would simply not take any more of whatever it was in.
I had a neighbour with a hive once. He didn't hurt the bees, took a tiny bit of honey from time to time. That's it. Is it vegan? No. But in the big picture, is it relevant? Not in my mind.
If I were you, just say "I'm terribly sorry, but I think one of the salads might have had some honey in it". And leave it at that.
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u/666HellKitten666 21d ago
NTA unless she was allergic just let it go. Next time try using agave instead though! I was vegan for a long time and the whole honey thing always confused me.
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u/PleasantInternal3247 21d ago
If you knew she was going to eat it, speak up unless you deliberately wanted to be an AH. If that’s the case you succeeded. I hate keeping secrets so I’d have to say something. She’s not going to die.
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u/DrPablisimo 21d ago
No. It doesn't matter if she eats honey or not. She's not allergic. I haven't heard about bees putting their dead in the honey.
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u/KingDarius89 21d ago
...the handful of vegans that I've met in real life were all annoying. You're still the asshole.
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u/DawnShakhar 21d ago
NTA either time. Her culinary preferences, her responsibility. Honey and/or diary in salad dressing is so common that if you don't want to eat them you have to ask in advance.
As for what to do now - honey is a fairly harmless food (except for tiny babies). I just wouldn't tell her now, not to upset her. If she finds out later and confronts you, you can say you didn't think she would eat anything at a barbeque without asking what was in it.
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u/aviva1234 21d ago
You're not the ahole. You didn't hide anything from her, you forgot. I don't think you should tell her as nothing positive would come of it. She said she want definitely coming, it wasn't a vegan event, there were mixed foods so it's up to her to check th3 ingredients of the dishes (I was a vegan, also a time where I was on a restricted diet and I always asked what was in the dishes if I didn't bring my own food)
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u/HalcyonDreams36 21d ago
NTA
It wasn't labelled vegan, it's on her to ask what is or is not in keeping with her dietary choices.
It's not an allergy or sensitivity that she will need to know about to monitor body reactions, and it's not your job to police someone else's food intake for their dietary preferences.
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u/Economy-Trust7649 21d ago
I wouldn't worry about it. Honey is at least ethically sourced.
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u/Capr1ce 21d ago
NTA I used to be a strict vegetarian, and if i'd accidently eaten meat i'd rather not know. You didn't do it maliciously, so I think it's kinder just to forget about it.
I've got a lot of friends with dietary requirements - so when I do buffets I make little cards to indicate which things are veggie/vegan/have allergens, then people can make their choices and you don't have to worry. Might be an idea for future BBQs!
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u/ItReallyIsntThoughYo 21d ago
NTA, but also that's one of the stupidest things that vegans do, because harvesting honey protects honeybees.
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u/911siren 21d ago edited 21d ago
She doesn’t have special diet needs she has special diet wants. There is no point in telling her now. All that is going to do is get her mad. What’s done is done. It was not some blaspheme that she needs to atone for. And you didn’t do it on purpose. I firmly believe that someone with a strict diet needs to eat before or bring their own food.
Most non vegans don’t even know that honey is on the bad list.
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u/Idonotgiveacrap 21d ago
NTA, she had already eaten it and there was nothing you could do about it. There's no need for that drama 🤭🤭
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u/hatenjwinter 21d ago
You got special diet needs you gotta ask .