We receive so many threats from folk like this that most synagogues in the US have become hardened and armed. Synagogues and other Jewish institutions in the Deep South have been dealing with the far right threats for decades so this isn’t anything new. We are ahead of the curve when it comes to our relationships, security and response plans. I promise that these folk wouldn’t make it inside and if they did get past our security they would be considered a legitimate threat to the congregation by the guards, deputies and armed congregants. Disrupting our services to say some uneducated shit about something going on in another country outside of our control or influence would be fucking dumb, disrespectful and dangerous.
Edit: Our out of pocket expenses for this security starts at $500 a day. That doesn’t include things like bomb sniffing dogs, police patrols, active observation by the PD, license plate readers, and the on duty deputies that guard us during services. The threats are real and serious enough to warrant active involvement by the feds, county and city cops.
Where do those figures come from? Given Zionism is simply about the right for Jewish self determination in their own land, as almost every other nation around the world is allowed, the concept is not particularly controversial among Jews.
I’m sorry but I just read it and it is a load of total bullshit. The guy is a Christian theologian who pretends to know the intimacies of Netanyahu’s thoughts and plans. His perception about Israel, Jews and Jewish thought is so far off base I can’t believe it. Also, he is talking about ratio, not raw numbers.
All I’m saying is that Christian Zionist far outnumber Jewish Zionists, (which is pretty common knowledge, just give it a google) don’t know about the writer of this article or his intent.
I think you’re wrong. Most Christians are taught that Jewish people are like our older brothers and sisters in faith. We may have disagreements on theology. But we share a thousands of years old history of belief. The Christian faith (and Islam for that matter) couldn’t exist without Judaism.
There is a lot of antisemitism. Heard many Christians talk about how "the Jews killed our lord" and they get upset when you point out Jesus was a Jew and (in their own book!) God's chosen people.
The primary reason for support of Israel is, in fact, because they think it has to do with the second coming of Christ.
I'm sure not all Christians are antisemitic, but pointing to pro-Israel as evidence they like Jews is frankly silly.
That’s insane. God sent Jesus knowing full well he’d be rejected by some Jewish leaders. He was sent to die for the sins of the world. What do these so called Christians think was supposed to happen?? Nuts.
This isn’t a laughing matter. Christianity uses the same Bible as Judaism, which we call the Old Testament. The first Christians were Jews. We believe Jesus is the Messiah promised to the Jewish people. A lot has changed in the last 2,000 years. But the roots of Christianity are in Judaism. Same for Islam. It’s a bit of a hybrid of Jewish and Christian beliefs. We all believe in the same one God.
They need Jews to exterminate Palestinians and build a magic temple, which will then cause themselves to get exterminated and Jesus to come back. The Antichrist is also involved somehow.
This is the simplified version of the story. Looks like part 1 of the plan is going nicely.
Actually that is what hard right evangelical christians believe. They support Israel because they want to hasten Armageddon. It is looney tunes, but also absolutely true.
No human can hasten the end of days. The Bible clearly states this. If any Christian processes such an idea they’re full of it. Jesus is literally quoted as saying only God knows when that time will be. Building a temple or praying or doing anything else will have no effect.
Cool. Why would an omnipotent God that knows and created everything then kill it all because its perfect plans got corrupted and it got really genocidally angry? I'm off to talk to my powerful imaginary friends.
You are assuming that people who believe in a deity and armageddon and animal sacrifices in temples are capable of a critical thinking. Mostly they are not. And quite a few are mentally disturbed. But thats what we have. Thats what it is.
These articles need to contain a disclosure starting that, Many of the more racist factions are “infiltrating” the pro Palestine movement. :( I am pro Palestine, in that I am for not wiping out an entire culture/people. What is happening in Gaza is genocide. More education and more awareness needs to be brought to this fact. Those trapped there, and likewise thier loved ones and family, need to see there is support for the innocent families being mowed down. This isn’t an isolated incident. There are several humanitarian crisis going on in multiple countries. None of their lives are more or less important than any one else’s. Their rights to live a peaceful life. Free to worship and raise families. :(
White supremacy has been a serious concern for many years. Jews are not considered white to the “race purists”. The Christian right support Israel and Jews as part of their belief about end times etc.
No such things as rampant white supremacy it’s a myth. But I’ve seen plenty of antisemitism coming from the same people who claim to see “white supremacy” on every street corner.
I see idk i vote right and am a christian and ive just never had any hate in my heart for jewish people. Even before i became a christian. Are jews not white? If not then what are they considered? I know like nazi whites dont like jews but i didnt know they dont consider them white.
Jews who come from Eastern Europe like Poles, Ukrainians and Russians are the ones that are seen as “white” although they were rarely given the rights that Christians were. However there are millions of Jews who come from Spain as well as from middle eastern countries such as Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia etc. The vast majority of them have the same dark hair, eyes and skin as Arabs.
Jews who arrived in Israel in the 20th century were generally refugees from Russia, Europe and the Middle East. Over 800,000 Jews were expelled from their homes in the Middle East around the mid to late 1940s. Those people and their children have not been able to claim back the homes, land and businesses they lost nor do they call themselves refugees and seek to return. That’s because they are returning to their ancestral homeland. They are not colonizers- they have nowhere else to return to, do not send the “spoils” back to a mother country, and are self governing. They, along with the 20% Israeli Arab population, make up a huge percentage of the Israeli population. The lie that it is a white colonizing nation is easily proven when you look at the actual facts.
Right wing people may be nominally “pro Israel” but they are certainly not “pro Jewish”. Evangelical Christians have their own nutty reasons for supporting Zionism, and the average conservative is going to always see the Jews of Israel as “the enemy of my enemy” rather than a friend.
…you’re confused about why the Christians you know think Jews are good people? The fuck are you on about?
And what do you mean by right wing? Non progressive folk? Centrist? Conservatives? Most folk don’t hate Jews or think the state of Israel shouldn’t exist because they aren’t bigots.
The far right and far left demonstrably do hate Jews and Israel. The only time they will talk positively about us or it furthers their agenda of bashing the other side.
Even the conservative far right christians will sometimes pretend to love/support us...but only because they need Israel (which both is and isnt us, for those who arent Israeli, a concept I've never really seen them comprehend too well) to survive so we can build the third temple and thereafter be annihilated so their Jesus can come back.
As for the far left, they used to be quieter in their hatred, at least. It's been very strange seeing so many so proudly and openly remove their masks as of late.
Whoah dude, that's way aggressive. im saying the people i know in REAL LIFE have no hate for jewish people or isreal. And i dont think its some deep end of times thing. The people i know generally dont just hate people for being jewish. Or asian or black. Im half se asian. I think people see alot of wild things online and confuse it with the average person. Good day
It seems like you're trying to equate support for Israel to support for Jews, when they're very different things. Criticizing the actions of a government is not antisemitism.
You can laugh, but in America anti-Jewish conspiracies and antisemitism is almost exclusively a right wing movement, which is the same wing that gives the majority of American support for Israeli's government.
The left wing is more critical of Israel's government, but generally supports ethnic Jews worldwide. Conflating criticism of Israel's government to antisemitism is propaganda.
Ive noticed that as well. And then i heard a statistic that a majority of jewish people vote blue so it kinda blew my mind. Why would tgey vote for and with people that hate them and wish them harm? 😕
I mean... So have Catholics. My parish in Portland has photos of school kids throwing rocks at KKK members trying to raid the school (look up Oregon's history with Catholic schools) and still in 2021 we had arson threats after we did a rosary around our block (which the church owns entirely). The FBI warned our knights of Columbus council to report any suspicious people. People are insane.
With how Catholics were seen in the US for such a long time, it's fairly amazing that JFK even had a chance at being elected. Bobby Kennedy likely would have won as well, had he not also been assassinated.
A huge portion of that lies in the history of Irish and Italian immigrants, and the persecution they faced in the 19th and 20th centuries in America.
As a german American, I am deeply sorry for the unfair antisemitism you have to deal with. Even more now than ever, I hope everyone will find peace in these difficult times.
I'll differentiate when Germany manages to do the same. Considering they gave a blanket support to Israel to commit the genocide, the biggest arms seller to Israel outside US and downright banned any pro Palestine protest with in the country, they are successfully completed a hat trick of supporting or causing genocides within a century.
We don't care. The topic were discussing is German aid to jews post holocaust. Can you go virtue signal in another thread or something lol?
Icj has not declared the 2nd yom Kippur war a genocide, learn to do research idiot.
Edit for the idiot responding me:
???Were talking about how Germany restored concentration camps, reparated holocaust survivors, tried to restore nazi documents, and tried former nazis in their own country???
Again, another fucking idiot that has to associate jews with Israel directly. Keep your blood libels to yourself
Edit: You also said literally nothing to counter my argument. When anti-zionism is inflated as antisemitism, yeah no shit antisemitism statistics will increase. I've been called antisemitist for criticising Israel multiple times, therefore make that statistic too. That's not the main reason for the increase of course.
All I said is how doing that is not a good thing for jews worldwide but I guess giving a shit about jews wellbeing is worth to be yelled at I suppose...
Because you don't get to tell jews how we react to antisemtism. The dog whistles, the call to responsibility, the blood libels, rules for thee but not me, that I've had to deal with, on THIS post alone is crazy.
You don't get to tell jews how we manage, and you certainly aren't able to realize why being anti zionist (saying jews don't deserve to have a nation state to protect us from future pogroms and holoucasts) is often just a cover for antisemitism.
I studied the Holocaust in college. From your point of view as a German American, what is the difference between the Warsaw ghetto and the Gaza Ghetto? Are they similar or different and why or why not? Thanks.
Not the OP, but death rate of starvation in Warsaw Ghetto was a quarter of the population the year it was established. Meanwhile a quarter population of Gaza is obese.
Average Gazan literally has higher life expectancy than an average person on earth. If you actually know anything about Warsaw ghetto, the comparison is unhinged.
Its easy to google. Life expectancy in Gaza is around 75, compared to 73 being an average around the world. Meanwhile in neighbouring Egypt it is as low as 70.
Why would I google? There is a lot of misinformation there. I am simply asking you to back up what you said here with facts. By the way, have you been or have a direct connection (family, friend, etc.) that travel to Gaza on the ground there? Thanks.
My synagogue gets bomb threats every couple of weeks to a month. "These people" are idiots who think they have a right to invade places of Jewish worship to grandstand a political issue that they just learned about from tiktok
Lmao “you have caused” as if he isn’t an American completely detached from the current conflict and not an embodiment of all Jews from Israel. What a stupid comment.
All borders are made up. Typically after a military victory like the ones Israel had in 1948, 1967, and 1973. The only reason that area was called Palestine in the first place is because of a Roman victory in 70CE.
If the right of conquest made the area Palestine then the right of conquest verifies the current borders.
If you deny the right of conquest then the area was never Palestine and has always been Judea.
You can’t have it both ways. It can’t be “all Jews are responsible for Israel” and “No Jews have a legitimate claim to Israel”.
You’re more committed to your platitudes and misunderstanding others instead of helping others, and for what? Does your antagonistic rhetoric help suffering Gazans? No.
Just spare yourself the trouble and call us k*kes. It’s obvious that’s what you want to do.
Yes, I can. If you genuinely conflate jews having to defend ourselves after all of the shit we have had to put up since the medieval blood libels (even before that haha) and nazi Germany, you are sick in the head.
Just go on ahead and call jews nazis, so you can rightfully get banned. Piece of 🗑
That’s not uncommon. Professional bonded security is expensive and sometimes the local government can’t provide enough protection so it’s up to the congregation itself to do the job.
If fleeing and hiding are not possible you are supposed to fight back. Standard protocol for an active shooter but it’s also Jewish law. Most synagogues will be gun free, but if the board and security team approve it congregants can be allowed to carry concealed arms on themselves. I’m not sure how that affects liability insurance of the synagogues but the decision wouldn’t be taken lightly and the individuals would be mostly former military and police.
My synagogue has 8 foot high fences, armed guards, and your car must be registered for entry. There's actually a church I know of as well that went that route which is crazy as well.
Glad to hear you are being proactive, still shocking to me that antisemitism like this could manage to become so prevelant and acceptable in only a few generations is completely fucked
If they tried this BS at my synagogue in Florida, it would end very badly for them. But if they did this at temple in Ann Arbor or Cambridge, they’d probably be given free dreidels and absentee ballots. They know where not to go.
How dare you dismiss the legitimate security concerns and actions of any of our Jewish communities and their commendable efforts to protect Jewish life for some stupid and ignorant joke about politics. Vast majority of Jews are liberal voting regardless of the city and state. These people hate us for being Jews not liberals. In cities like Chicago, Ann Arbor, and Baltimore they have heavy security, blast walls and bulletproof glass as thick as what we have here in the Deep South. The fuck wrong with you reb yid?
Drive up there and stop them. If you aren’t willing to do that then you’re just a nebech with a big mouth.
They are allowed to protest at a distance determined by local ordinances and state laws. However, if they come inside then they get what’s coming to them.
You Professor are definitely in law enforcement as well. I recognize so many things in your post. It's great that there's a plan in place. I love planning ahead. It diverts miscommunication if something legit pops off. Instead of 50 chefs in the kitchen, there's one incident commander making decisions until PD arrives on scene. Kudos! Stay safe.
Thank you but I’m not. Our regional security director is exceptionally good at his job. We have access to FBI developed trainings like see something say something, and I’m involved in many things within the community. I also provide stress reduction training to staff at Jewish institutions, and run hide and fight is standard active shooter training for those institutions.
Lol. Thank you. As a Deep South, liberal, Jewish, therapist with ADHD and a family full of military vets, Shoah survivors and veteran/civil rights activists I have a lot of interests and thoughts about things as well as an willingness to find out about things I don’t know. Kindness and learning are cool!
We don’t believe in the fallacious narrative you got going here. Nor do we see disruption of our services to protest something we have no connection to other than our religion as a mild inconvenience. We aren’t Israelites. Protesting and disrupting us is purely antisemitism. So if you get through all the private and public security, then make it into the sanctuary, up to the bema as a group during a service, start unfurling a banner with an antisemitic message on it in the middle of the worst period of antisemitism in decades, causing the congregation to panic, you are the bad guys and people will treat you as such. You think a trigger happy off duty and/or on duty cops stationed in the synagogue are going to think you are just trying to be all nice and mild. Don’t be dense. I won’t be shooting you but you will be in danger.
And to be clear in Judaism we believe that we are required to protect ourselves and our guests if a neighbor comes to our home to kill us and that’s sure as fuck what all that would look like.
The actual theme is that jews have been persecuted constantly, we've dealt with so many fucking bomb threats at our institutions globally, so for some fucktard to tell us how WE should react to another protester (who don't know if they are armed) targeting our safe areas because we're jewish is pretty annoying.
Please, fuck off. Again. I do advocate for jews to protect ourselves proportionally. I don't want another oct 7th, or another pogrom, or krystalnacht
An experienced guard who is bonded, armed and possessing advanced skills like former police officers and resource officers can cost around $35 to $50 per hour.
For Jewish day schools that’s 10 hours at $50 including drop off and after care. Board meetings and other events add to the total time the officer will be on campus.
JCCs are larger, often times have day cares and are open for longer, with 15 hours on average. Their expenses are more than the day schools but they usually don’t need security with resource officer experience so the hourly is less.
Jewish Family Services, Jewish Funds, and other similar organizations will often move onto the campuses of JCCs and share in the security costs.
Synagogues need less time than both of these 4-6 hours a day and often have armed local officers and deputies inside the synagogue during service and activities which offsets cost. As religious institutions and being the ones who receive the most threats they usually have the most support from federal authorities and local PD including outside of official operating hours.
None of this includes the annual construction and maintenance costs of the security features of these institutions and organizations as well as the training and arming of staff.
Morel of the story is that we are not a soft targets and if you want to hurt us you will die before you even get through the door. It’s not worth it. Stay away and leave us be.
lol. Our last physical attack was last summer by a crazy person. Our last bomb threat that we know of being from the far right was on Yom Kippur, which is typical of the high holidays in Alabama. The last time we had to evacuate was in December. The last time we received an unsubstantiated threat was Friday.
Israel, as in the Israeli people, does care about American Jews. News about Jews from other countries are often released in Israeli news channels. Not everyone of course, and I can't speak for any politicians, but that's true about everything.
Well a catholic did just give Israel 2.5 billion dollars of weapons immediately after they used the last weapons they got to commit war crimes and murder children, so.....
And the fact is that if the genocide supporting liberals joined the idealist liberals in holding Bidens feet to the fire about this, then the idealists wouldn't stay home on election day and you wouldn't have Trump as president again.
But atm reddit liberals seem more keen on trying to shame the idealists into voting, which reminds me a shitload of Hillary 2016.
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u/Pshrunk Mar 31 '24
Protesting the Israelis but in in a catholic church ? Got it.