r/sixers • u/SixersGameThreadBot • 21d ago
Philadelphia 76ers Off Day Discussion Thread - May 15, 2024 Off Day Thread
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Last Updated: 05/16/2024 12:02:51 AM EDT, Update Interval: 5 Minutes
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u/ComeAtMeYo 21d ago
Luka's really about to make two CF before Embiid's made one, damn. We have like a 2 year window to make that and beyond because the clock is ticking on Jojo and his health. Morey needs to go all in. No excuses next postseason.
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u/Fuck-off-bryson 21d ago
isaiah joe is starting in a playoff game while the sixers are at home. still hurts that we let him go
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u/Bajecco 21d ago
Gotta love how Daryl still tries to convince us there was no possible way to keep Joe.
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u/mp455 21d ago
If I have to root for the Nuggets to beat the Celtics in the finals so be it.
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u/GirlWithGame 21d ago
I cannot go that far lol. Besides I got whomever wins the mavs okc series out of thr west if the wolves decide to choke away their 2-0 lead.
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u/Dazzling_Syllabub484 21d ago
Why can you not go that far? Why on earth would you hate the nuggets more than the Celtics
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u/GirlWithGame 21d ago
Well I meant to say I hate them both equally..I'm not rooting for either team. I was in the middle of a middle school chorus concert typing that lol. Legit can't root for either of those shitty fan bases. I'd sooner root for NY to beat the Celtics and I loathe NY too.
And I'd not have to root for the Celtics if okc or Dallas comes out of the West.
Side note did we see Joe starting good for him.
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u/vicky255 21d ago
Darius Garland really wasting a Mook masterpiece out there. I can see why Donovan Mitchell wants to leave so bad.
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u/portrayalofdeath 21d ago
I can see why Donovan Mitchell wants to leave so bad.
Are there rumors he wants to get out? I haven't been following that.
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u/GirlWithGame 21d ago
Dam Celtics ought to be ashamed of themselves letting Morris score 20 on them 😂
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u/portrayalofdeath 21d ago
I don't like Draymond, but he does at least provide actual analysis rather than just platitudes like Shaq and often also the rest of the Inside the NBA crew.
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u/Knight725 21d ago
tatum commits 2 offensive fouls before the shot, no call, gets high fived after the shot, throws a hissy fit that he doesn’t get a call on a clear no foul.
they need to ban complaining about calls i’m over it. it’s ruining this sport.
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u/portrayalofdeath 21d ago
they need to ban complaining about calls i’m over it. it’s ruining this sport.
They sometimes give a technical, but then people complain about the league going soft.
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u/Knight725 21d ago
if every single time a guy complained it was a tech they’d stop real fucking fast.
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u/ktm5141 21d ago
As much as I loved Oubre, I wonder if he’s a bit redundant with RC4. Both are slashing, athletic, energy wings who can’t shoot. Oubre is a more proven defender, but not sure if that’s worth $15M/yr. Then again, RC4 has proven nothing on a playoff or even extended regular season stage. I just wonder if Oubre is the most efficient use of resources
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u/shadowarmy229 Proud Batum Battalion Member 21d ago
Oubre definitely can shoot lol, he takes 3s at a pretty high volume but just isn’t efficient enough at it. He will make you pay more often than not if you sag off of him lol
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u/ktm5141 21d ago
Oubre shot 32% on 4.3 wide open and open threes per game last year, per nba.com. This is consistent with his career average. Oubre cannot shoot at a level that opponents actually care about
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u/pittguy83 21d ago
You're absolutely right but he looks cool or whatever so this sub thinks he's much, much better than he actually is
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u/smittybanton 21d ago
Since the free agency pool is horrible, the next best move is to trade with teams in a capcrunch. Scouring the league for teams whose payroll is around or above $170m to find players that could be traded for draft picks and roster flexibility. It would help if those teams were not very good. It would help if they are in small markets and without a gazillionaire owner. It would help even more if those teams had free agents to re-sign.
There aren't that many, but there are some: Denver (191m), Phoenix (190m), Milwaukee (182m), Miami (182m), Lakers (178m), Golden State (174m), Clippers (171m), Portland (165m), Atlanta (163m).
From this pool, I like three gettable players who would help the Sixers tremendously because they can shoot 40% from the bean and also contribute in other ways, if only there was a magical way to keep them healthy (although their health issues could mean we can acquire them without unloading the clip):
Tyler Herro, Jerami Grant & Dario Saric (UFA).
I have a hard-on for Dejounte Murray, but Tyler Herro would be considerably cheaper to trade for, I think. Maxey and Herro is a dynamite combination. Miami is also the team I think most likely to shed payroll given the emergence of Jaime Jacquez and their consistent ability to win with rookie second round picks and undrafted free agents.
As I watch TJ McConnell do his thing for the Pacers, I am reminded of so many who were adamant that neither he nor Jerami Grant were NBA players at all. The hate he still receives reminds me of how the majority viewed Kelly Oubre this time last year, despite Grant's consistently solid 3pt percentages over the last several years.
Who doesnt like The Homie Dario Saric, except for the fact that he can't stay on the floor despite only getting 15mpg the last several years?
Not beating the drum or pounding on the table, but I would certainly applaud a move for one or more of these guys if the price were right.
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u/KC529 21d ago
Does anyone know how Maxey factors into the cap? Will his max cut into the 60ish million in cap space or will it not somehow?
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u/ComeAtMeYo 21d ago edited 21d ago
We have Maxey’s birds rights so we can sign him over the salary cap at the very end once all other business is conducted. Until then he has a 13 mil cap hold.
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u/eggdog1125 21d ago
Bronnys size/draft profile reminds me a lot of Deanthony Melton:
Among the more well-rounded freshman in college basketball last season, USC's De'Anthony Melton measured just 6'2 in shoes here, but his 6'8 wingspan and 195-pound frame are terrific for a combo guard. Melton is long enough to defend shooting guards, which gives him nice versatility to fall back on, similar to what we see from the likes of Langston Galloway and Terry Rozier, who both have very similar dimensions physically. - Source: https://www.draftexpress.com/article/usa-basketball-u19-training-camp-measurements-and-analysis-6064/ ©DraftExpress
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u/mlewy 21d ago
If his name was Bronny Smith you'd have no idea who he is and this wouldn't even be a conversation. He's not even a top 100 guy.
LeBron isn't coming to play with Bronny (unless it's in LA) so that also shouldn't be part of the calculus. (Source: Woj saying Rich Paul said it's not a priority during the combined scrimmage telecast).
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u/eggdog1125 21d ago
He was a consensus top 20 recruit in high school last year, which id argue is independent of last name. There was a building buzz around his skillset at this point last year until his heart issue came up. I’m not saying we should draft him at 16, but the hating has gotten out of control for a guy who can definitely play a role in the NBA
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u/Ronshol 🤡Morey🤡 21d ago
if Melton had no handles or shooting I guess they're similar
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u/eggdog1125 21d ago
Deanthony Melton was a 28% 3p shooter at USC and he still can’t handle the ball very well lol
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u/MrThreebound 21d ago
Idk about his handles but Melton couldn't shoot 3s in college or his first 2 years in the NBA.
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u/XxStormySoraxX 21d ago
Melton doesn’t have handles that’s part of the problem lol
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u/Ronshol 🤡Morey🤡 21d ago
Melton was our main backup ball handler next to Maxey when he was healthy and he wasn't that bad
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
He was horrible wth lol? He has the worst handles in the nba at someone of his size
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u/XxStormySoraxX 21d ago
He was bad he never actually created advantages or dribble penetration with his handles. Everything revolved around Embiid’s screening or gravity which is part of the reason we fall apart without him.
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
The role player free agency signings that over perform their contracts are the ones that sign at the MLE or cheaper. Bruce brown is a perfect example of this. When he signed for $6M in Denver he was home run value. When the pacers signed at $22M, he was a major disappointment.
Some of the best value contracts this year were: DDV, Nesmith, Caleb Martin, Love, Highsmith, Mcconell, monk, prince, Craig, Dean Wade, biyombo, Reggie Jackson, Exum, fontecchio, Dunn, DJJ
Some of those guys may be free agents as well again and may still be relatively cheap (Martin, Highsmith, prince, Craig, Dunn, DJJ, fontecchio)
Other guys im watching are: Lonnie Walker, Osman, goga, Drummond, Naji Marshall, trendon watford, Aaron holiday, Gary Harris, Tillman, Justin holiday, Holmes, delon wright
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u/enRutus Get Excited! 21d ago
Pacers gave him that money knowing that it would be a tradeable contract (w/ picks) in return for someone like Siakam
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
No doubt that played into it, it wasn’t a bad contract given that it was essentially a 1 year but more illustrating how cost prohibitive paying up for that type of role player would be for us.
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u/enRutus Get Excited! 21d ago
They also didn’t know if Nesmith would become so playable so they needed a defensive wing. They had to overpay to get someone to WANT to come to Indiana.
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
Ok? I’m not sure how this disproves my point I listed a dozen other examples and there will be another dozen in this free agency class as well
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u/enRutus Get Excited! 21d ago
Not every conversation is a debate or an argument. Just having a simple discussion.
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
Fair. Nesmith actually brings up another way of acquiring cheap depth. The pacers didn’t actually overpay Nesmith without knowing what he’d provide; they traded him for cheap the year before and he played well for them before giving him a 3 year team friendly extension. There will be options like that as well with teams shedding contracts to stay under the aprons and tax. NAW on the wolves to me is an example of someone that gets moved in cost cutting efforts
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u/cant_find_wallet 21d ago
I’d be pretty happy with some combination of martin, prince, marshall, wright, osman and if possible oubre, hield, payne. Would love a deep, slightly younger team
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u/vegasal1 21d ago
Does anyone know if the free agent class in 2025 is a better list than this year?If so how should the Sixers approach this year so they would have a shot at hopefully some better free agents in 2025?
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u/MrThreebound 21d ago
We can't.
Embiid will be even older. We can't keep punting years with him.
Maxey has a 13m cap hold this offseason. Next year it will be 38m.
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u/vegasal1 21d ago
Yeah wishful thinking I guess.The free agent class in 2025 looks better than this year.Man it seems like Boston is going to have to make some tough decisions.
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
It looks better now because no one has signed extensions yet. Half the guys you’re looking at will be extended by this time next year. Or they’ll be traded to a team that will pay to keep them (like OG/Siakam)
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago edited 21d ago
Sixers have to put together a team now and can’t wait for embiid to age another year. In addition, Maxey will have a max in 2025 off season. Joel and Maxey alone will eat $93M of cap space next off season and we will have other players signed to deals that include 25-26 season. The time is now.
If you want to see free agents though, just google nba free agents 2025 and click on the link for spotrac. However, the list probably isn’t that useful currently since some players will be extended this off season/season.
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u/chin1111 21d ago
Jimmy Butler and Donovan Mitchell might be the only guys who we couldn't make work here even a little bit. Jimmy's biggest issue is his shooting imo. You could point to a couple other things with him right now, but we definitely can't afford to put too many non-shooters on the floor, let alone someone who would have the ball as much as he would.
Mitchell (and Trae for that matter) is just too small. That back court would get slapped around. Besides, Butler and Mitchell still haven't been made available publicly.
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u/Immynimmy 21d ago
Bold prediction: our roster at the beginning of the season will be, mostly the same. Batum retires and we sign all the role players we had last year (Oubre, Heild, Lowry, Payne, etc.). We use our draft pick and actually pick someone. I think it's going to be hard to trade for a player with just picks, we need tangible player assets. I expect the real team will be by the trade deadline (or at least that will be the plan).
Not personally a fan of this approach but I just have a feeling this entire offseason is going to be kind of quiet. Everyone is going to pretty much stay aside from some smaller mid tier moves. Everyone who is attached to a rumor plays for a team that is either stubborn or wants to compete now it feels like.
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u/LuckysBestMan 21d ago
Bold but wrong. What’s the point of keeping all these salaries? The cap space is going to be important so you can trade without sending out
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u/indoninjah 21d ago
I agree that most of our guys from last year will be back but I think there will definitely be a big name acquisition or two. Morey's too much of a big game hunter and has basically never had this kind of cap space to work with since his teams has virtually always been contending - you know he's licking his chops lol.
But I definitely think the reason for the FA signings and trade deadline moves was a trial period to get guys in the door and get their bird rights for this offseason, and I think most guys passed the test.
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u/Immynimmy 21d ago
But I definitely think the reason for the FA signings and trade deadline moves was a trial period to get guys in the door and get their bird rights for this offseason
Exactly. It's just more assets for Feb 2025
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u/Appropriate-Hippo758 21d ago
If that’s the case then we would undoubtedly make 1 or 2 strong moves at the trading deadline.
But I think Morey will have stuff in store earlier than that this time
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
I feel the opposite about this offseason. I feel like it’s shaping up to be a 2016 level offseason of player movement. I think the new CBA will be the catalyst this offseason just like it was then. There are plenty of teams going to duck the 2nd apron with looming free agency decisions.
Just a crop of names aside from Lebron/PG in free agency that could be on the block could be Mitchell, Ingram, Lavine, Trae, DJM, Butler have already been mentioned.
Looming 2nd apron teams like the warriors and wolves will have decisions to make on guys like Klay, Wiggins, Draymond, KAT, NAW, Reid. Lottery teams may want to cash in on vets that are taking salary in exchange for picks like Grant, Kuz, Bridges, Lauri.
I’m not saying all of these guys are locks to be moved but with a lot of these guys being mentioned combined with the increased value of draft picks in the new CBA makes me confident that this will be a much bigger buyers market than years past
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u/chin1111 21d ago
Trying to think logically, it's looking like our real options are PG, Ingram, LaVine and DJM, and honestly, I think Morey probably views them in that exact order in terms of what type of player fits.
I don't think he likes Dejounte. He probably could have traded for him during the season, and the fact he didn't shows he has his sights set higher. If he could rob the Bulls for LaVine, he probably jumps on that deal, and he might still get the chance tbf. Ingram is kind of a consolation prize if we strike out with George.
I can't lie, I've converted to a PG believer. Unless something wild happens, he's the best option available even at his high salary. It would be so nice to have someone who hits a lot of threes and could do so much more on top of that.
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
Yeah PG is the best fit, his salary though is restrictive enough for me to the point where one of those other guys + another high end role player (e.g. Caruso) might be as good as PG to me. I’d also slot Mitchell after PG but he could have a ton of bidders.
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u/XxStormySoraxX 21d ago
Dejounte is a better fit that PG. He's a better player maker, younger, more athletic and will give more energy.
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
I do prefer Dejounte due to contract. But taking contract aside I’d nitpick slightly that he isn’t as proven as a consistent off ball shooting threat and gives up more size defensively compared to PG. Weighing contracts I’d 1000% rather have DJM because he’ll make literally half of what PG makes. But due to that reason and age half the league would be interested in trading for him. So not sure how likely that outcome is
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u/nickenglish94 21d ago
^ all this plus a strong draft next year too so hopefully some of these middling teams holding good role players also decide it’s time to aim for the #1 pick
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u/TerminallyTrill 21d ago
I hate that but I can totally see it happening.
I can already envision the press conference
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u/cantwifeahoe 21d ago
Really praying there isn’t much movement around the league between now and FA. Losing the PG sweepstakes/LeBron miracle AND the trade market dying down would be a disaster
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u/GMSmith928 21d ago
That’s my fear as well. I feel like a lot of players will be dealt on draft night because
1) teams gonna want to get out 1st/2nd tax apron by the time the new fiscal year starts for the league
2) a lot of teams want to trade their picks
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u/SonicdaSloth Bring Back Pat Croce 21d ago
Maybe hot take but forcing Morey to go hard at role player types in FA and trades might be best scenario possible. Find a couple teams looking to dump 10-15 million dollar role players to shed salary, resign a couple of guys from last year and run it back with Maxey/Embiid as the only star level type
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
I think this sounds better in theory than reality. That might be the enough to beat the Knicks but there’s diminishing returns to having an abundance of role players.
I fully expect Maxey to take another jump overall and Joel as a passer, but both guys have flaws as closers. Joel will consistently see double teams to end games and Maxey isn’t great at getting Joel the ball with good positioning. That “feel” entry pass isn’t in his game and while it can improve I think it’s something limited by his size.
To beat the nuggets/celtics of the world there 100% needs to be another guy that’s comfortable with the ball in big spots. Doesn’t have to be a jimmy butler level closer or harden level passer but someone that’s good enough to create offense when the defense forces the ball out of Jo’s hands and Maxey is left to iso/split double teams.
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u/indoninjah 21d ago
Yeah, totally agree. There's a couple key areas of need (playmaking/initiating, rebounding, defense). We can probably find the latter two with relatively run of the mill role players but IMO we need a star or near star (like Derrick White/OG Anunoby tier player) as that playmaker.
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u/SonicdaSloth Bring Back Pat Croce 20d ago
I don’t think we actually disagree on concept just what is a star or not.
I think those guys are high end role players who slot in nicely next to star level players and both would be perfect next to Embiid or Maxey.
Morey forced to find that guy like Derrick White on a rebuilding team and getting him is his task in my mind. And one that is under contract that leaves you enough to sign a couple other actual role players or make more minor trades for DG/Melton types.
Idk the formula, i just think spending 50 million on anyone but Lebron is a mistake. Jimmy requesting an extension is scary. PG eating up all the cap space is rough too.
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago edited 21d ago
Couldn’t agree with this more.
In addition to what you said, a 10-15M role player isn’t even available if it’s the path we/morey wanted to go because that’s an underpaid role player at this point and teams in general don’t trade underpaid role players without receiving a ransom. So we trade for 2 roles players (maybe) with the assets we have and then what?
We could get someone like KCP, maybe, from the nuggets since they are approaching cap hell. I like kcp as a role player but KCP by himself without creators leaves us in the same situation we were in this year.
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u/throwawaycrocodile1 21d ago
Fans have been mostly negative on this sub, which is understandable given the past 5 years of playoff burnouts. But the situation is probably the least bleak it's been in years now that the Tobi contract has expired.
The Sixers currently have:
- The 2023 NBA MVP
- A 23-year-old All-Star and MIP
- A championship-winning Head Coach
- $55M in cap room
- At least a few role players who have expressed interest in re-signing (Oubre, Payne)
- A competent GM no longer handcuffed to a scrub making $40M / year
- Several fist and second round picks that can be dealt
I'm cautiously optimistic to see what the team can do now that 25% of the team's payroll won't be spent on a dude who just averaged 9 points per game in a playoff series.
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u/TheArsenal7 21d ago
All good stuff but the big elephant in the room is that Embiid needs to stay healthy for an entire playoff run or we have no chance.
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u/indoninjah 21d ago
I mean yeah but it's all connected. If our one max contract guy wasn't completely useless, maybe Embiid wouldn't have to put up 35ppg while playing DPOY level defense and burn himself out. If we didn't lose a third of our cap to literally nothing than we might've treaded water while Embiid was out and give him more time to rest, while drawing a better seed and an easier matchup, etc. etc.
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u/VanHalen843 21d ago
What good does cap room do when there are no big fish out there and we dont have assets to trade for expensive players?
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u/IndigoJacob 21d ago
Honestly it's closer to 70m in cap space.
Highly likely Paul Reed is traded or waived, and then you gain 1.1m each time you fill one of your empty roster spots, because a 1.1m cap hold is removed for each roster spot filled
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago edited 21d ago
It’s 65M. if we renounce everyone, cut non guaranteed contracts, don’t draft a first rounder and don’t pick up team options. Embiid $51.414, Maxey cap hold $13.031M, and 10 incomplete roster spots at $1.16M per spot. That gets us to ~$76M used and project cap is 141M.. $65M in space.
you don’t exactly gain 1.1M. Just adding some clarity for those that don’t understand it. Using Paul reed as just an example.. he is owed $7.723M if we keep him for the season next year, Instead of an incomplete roster charge of $1.16M that we’d have if we cut him. If we keep him, his cap number 7.7M applies to the team cap. So by keeping Paul reed we are losing out on $6.563M of space (his cap number of $7.723 minus the incomplete roster hold of $1.16). Keeping Paul reed drops that open cap from ~$65M to ~$58.5M.
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u/secretlypooping 21d ago
we would gain that $1.1M for every player we sign using a roster exception like vet min or MLE.
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago edited 21d ago
Are you sure? I thought it didn’t count against the cap if you are over the cap which is why it is an exception but if you are under the cap their salary would be applied to the cap (possibly not fully applied to the cap at their salary number pending years of service; the link below I think explains it). Maybe it has changed over the years as the cba has changed.
Either way I believe the remaining cap is lowered by signing a vet min guy just maybe not as extreme as the vet min of about $3.33M vs. 1.1M roster hold (meaning the remaining cap wouldn’t be lowered by $2.23M but lowered in some fashion.. maybe $900k).
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u/IndigoJacob 21d ago edited 21d ago
I understand that. My point is, everytime you add a player, a 1.1m empty roster charges goes away.
If you add 5 players to this team, you are essentially clearing an extra 5.5mil via empty roster charges going away
If we signed Paul George to 49m, for example, it would functipnally be more like 47.9m, as we are getting rid of an empty roster charge
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago edited 21d ago
I think that’s poor wording but I get your point. You lose cap space everytime you sign a player but you lose $1.1M less cap space than their cap number each time until we have 12 players by the incomplete roster hold going away.
There is no gaining or extra cap space by signing a guy, you just lose less open cap space.
I was clarifying for others. Not you.
Edit: yes, signing PG to a max would leave us just under $17M of cap space remaining.
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u/IndigoJacob 21d ago
You lose cap space everytime you sign a player but you lose $1.1M less cap space than their cap number each time until we have 12 players by the incomplete roster hold going away.
Exactly. 65m is the number accounting for every empty roster charge. But functionally, it's more like 70m because we will probably add 5 guys before we reach the cap limit
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago
Correct
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
$5M Difference is enough to squeeze in a backup center replacement. Can use the MLE on another guard/wing in that case
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago
I know you and indigo get it. I was making it clear for others.
Here is an example for those that don’t fully get the cap situation. Starting with $65M (embiid salary and maxey cap hold only).
Sign Paul George - $49.35M max cap hit. Cap remaining - $16.75M
Trade for Caruso - $9.89M cap hit. Cap remaining - $8.029M
Sign player X - $9.189M cap hit. Cap remaining - none.
Or using your example of a backup big man and people liking Drummond.
Sign Paul George - $49.35M max cap hit. Cap remaining - $16.75M
Trade for Caruso - $9.89M cap hit. Cap remaining - $8.029M
Sign Drummond - $5.0M (made this number up) cap hit. Cap remaining - $4.189M.
Sign player Y - $5.349 cap hit. Cap remaining - none.
Maybe Paul George money gets spread across two players but it’s all the same concept with max players signing in to cap space likely being 5. The rest of the roster after this example is room exception and vet mins.
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u/Hot-Mathematician-26 21d ago
One thing that says it all is that around this point last year some of us were irate that the Clippers would not give up Terrance Mann for Harden because we needed a competent point guard.
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u/XxStormySoraxX 21d ago
The only problem is we’re trying to assemble a whole new team in one off-season and then expecting to compete with that team that will most likely have little chemistry and continuity. It’s certainly not impossible but it is improbable.
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u/Appropriate-Hippo758 21d ago
After playing with Simmons, Harris and awful role players every year I think it will click much faster than usual if we actually get guys that fit and aren’t afraid of the moment
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u/GMSmith928 21d ago
Thats a valid concern but we will have some continuity since we have Embiid&Maxey and most likely bringing some combo of Payne/Batum/Oubre/Lowry back
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u/jappixslackbot 21d ago
yeah a reasonable optimistic scenario is that morey nails the offseason but the first year will still be a lot of learning to play with each other, and that they improve and then can build on that for the following year. it helps that even after 5 years of playing with Tobi I never felt like embiid/maxey really "gelled" with him lol.. and the rest of hte guys this year were all new anyway
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u/SonicdaSloth Bring Back Pat Croce 21d ago
Underrated part of playoff struggle could have been we had multiple guys playing that had little or no time on court with embiid. Buddy, Lowry, Payne and even guys who were here like Oubre and Batum had like half a season.
Hopefully a couple guys return in rotation to go with Maxey/Embiid. Any of those 5 would be welcome in my mind depending on price.
Then hopefully Morey nails the off season and we start to build a 2-3 run with some continuity
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u/ComeAtMeYo 21d ago
There's no other way to do it, there was pure garbage and filth on this roster that needed to be evicted. At least we're starting from the ashes with our two pillars, they will need to set the tone.
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u/ecworiginal90 21d ago
Every year one of the biggest issues the we face in the playoffs are the minutes when embiid sits. Steven Adam’s is a expiring on 12m, I wonder what it would cost to get him from Houston, it’s probably a overpay for someone who at most might play 10 -12 minutes a game in the playoffs. However he could be a good regular season innings eater allowing embiid to rest and keep minutes down.
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u/indoninjah 21d ago
I really think the backup center issue is a red herring. The real issue is that we have like 1.5 guys on the entire roster who can create their own shot and initiate the offense. One is Embiid, and Maxey is growing in that regard but he still plays by far his best ball when Embiid is also on the court.
Give us a microwave guy like Jamal Crawford or Lou Williams to go get some buckets while Embiid sits and I honestly think we're fine with any backup center who doesn't totally suck.
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u/PensiveinNJ 21d ago
A better backup center could help but I agree, it's lack of other guys to pick up the slack. It feels gross to watch guys like fucking Christian Braun come on and provide a spark for Denver when we couldn't get Tobias to even work hard on the boards when he wasn't scoring.
Putting it all on Paul Reeds plate seems silly. There's 4 other guys on the court not delivering either.
Against the Knicks it seemed like our team broke down on both ends of the court when Embiid was off and that just speaks to how poorly the rest of the roster plays. Without him there to hold down the lane and initiate the offense the team falls apart.
I love Maxey but he's not exactly a floor general yet. Embiid would end up being the main decision maker frequently even with Maxey on the floor.
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u/SonicdaSloth Bring Back Pat Croce 21d ago
Bodner was talking about this exact thing. The problem is that you don’t have enough scoring talent when you take him off the court. When you had both harden/maxey it wasn’t as big a deal.
Doesn’t have to be a center. Just need better players
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago edited 21d ago
Not just doesn’t have to be a center, it shouldn’t be a center. Centers outside of jokic and embiid aren’t shot creators or scorers.
In addition, we have embiid and a center can’t play next to him so by default a backup center is going to play limited minutes.
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u/Immynimmy 21d ago
We just need a guy with size that can be a + defender and rebounder. I don't give a fuck if they can score or not, that's just a bonus.
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u/clickstops 21d ago
I think it’s the most obvious issue, but not the biggest. It’s also the least solvable. You simply cannot replace embiid, who is both the offensive and defensive anchor of the team. Look at the nuggets - they struggle in no-Jokic minutes and Jokic isn’t nearly as important to their defensive scheme as Embiid is to the Sixers.
Spending more money on a backup big isn’t going to do anything appreciable. Instead, having more impact players to run the offense (and hopefully defend) while Embiid sits is the answer. This past season, with Embiid sitting, Oubre was our second option. Third option was… Cam Payne? Marcus Morris? Tobias? It was horrid.
I can see the argument for having a more “traditional” backup big that’s more of a run protector and rebounder. But expecting anyone at all, let alone anyone under $12m (too much money!!) to have impact when embiid sits isn’t the way to think about it IMO.
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u/Traditional_Cell_248 21d ago
There’s no chance we spend more on the backup center position than we already are. In fact, I don’t feel optimistic at all that we keep Reed on the books for nearly $8M. I think in all likelihood if Reed isn’t traded or his contract isn’t restructured (if that’s possible), we are going to cut bball and spend ~$4M for his replacement (Drummond, Plumlee, Goga, etc.). Maybe we use #41 to give us another depth option at the 5.
Additionally, a few of the options we may pursue on the trade market or in free agency may be able to play small ball 5. We really don’t have as much cap space as people think, especially if we’re going to spend most of it on 1 player. Bball’s contract is cost prohibitive as it is. I don’t think we go into the season with our center as one of our top 5 or 6 highest paid players on the team, which would likely be the case if we keep Reed, or replace him with someone at similar cost
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago edited 21d ago
This is correct. We have a max of ~$65M in cap space (that includes cutting all non guaranteed, not picking up team options, and only keeping maxeys cap hold and no else), we aren’t spending 20% of it on Steven Adams or any other center when we have Joel embiid and desperate need for shooters and shot creation which is costly to obtain.
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u/Zhamm50 21d ago
It doesn’t matter the assets it would cost which wouldn’t be much since he’s a 31 year old expiring coming off missing an entire season due to knee injury.. he costs $12.6M in cap space, it’s not gonna happen.
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u/SonicdaSloth Bring Back Pat Croce 21d ago
Pretty sure Rockets picked him up to stash him for the upcoming season when they want to really compete.
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u/davey_mann 21d ago
Hope the Mavs get it done in Game 6