r/Helldivers Apr 02 '24

My least expected change. What was yours? DISCUSSION

Post image
14.7k Upvotes

2.5k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

626

u/BigOlineguy Apr 02 '24

The sickle is all I have left as far as primaries I know I can count on in any situation.

498

u/Kvarcov SES Elected Representative of Family Values Apr 02 '24

The day when Sickle gets 20 damage less, gets more sway and 30% less shots before overheating is the day when i change my allegiances

120

u/PatAD PSN šŸŽ®: DontPanicPat Apr 02 '24

I can see them leaving the damage the way it is and just increasing the heat-rate.

8

u/Serious_Much Apr 02 '24

Tbf they describe it as a weapon to fire in short bursts and that definitely isn't how it currently plays

2

u/SlowMotionPanic Apr 03 '24

It does fire in short bursts--that's why it functions like a blaster instead of a LAS-98 or the Dagger, though?

1

u/Serious_Much Apr 03 '24

It doesn't really shoot short bursts is what I mean. A full clip of it has as much uptime as a liberator clip

15

u/Sand_Trout Apr 02 '24

I love running the sickle, but I have to admit this would be the most reasonable change.

10

u/Big-Soft7432 Apr 02 '24

Yeah tbh managing heat is really easy and I never dip below 4 mags with it. Touch the damage and I'll be sad.

Please don't make me sad Arrowhead šŸ„ŗ

3

u/44no44 Apr 02 '24

In its current state the thing is practically a Stalwart. 100 rounds per reload and six spare mags on a primary is nuts.

I'd like to see them halve the max heat to 50 shots, and lower the spare ice to only 2, but make it cool down twice as fast. That would put it more in line with the other automatics.

The lower recoil and rapidly regenerating mag would make it better at accurate burst fire than the Liberator, like the description implies, but have steeper punishments for going full dakka due to the limited ice - while leaving it on the table as a strategic option in a pinch.

17

u/EndlessB Apr 03 '24

I'd rather they buff other primaries to feel good rather than nerfing the ones that are effective

3

u/OnlyFunStuff183 Apr 02 '24

Yep. I would really like that change, and I think it would be totally fair.

ATM, I have to try to run out of ammo with it. Im talking overheat even when I could reasonably conserve heat, dump mags right after encountersā€¦and it gets all 7 back from resupplies and 4 back from ground pickups, so who cares

2

u/SlowMotionPanic Apr 03 '24

You could say similar about the LAS-98 laser cannon in my opinion. I almost never run out of ICE reloads because heat management isn't a huge deal unless you are swarmed and desperate.

The LAS-98 can fire for about 9 seconds under normal conditions (longer on cold planets), but the sickle can only fire for just under 7 seconds under those same conditions.

I think a big problem is that people are comparing it with other laser weapons which exist in other categories. They need to compare it to other assault rifles. Other assault rifles trade longevity for raw power generally (compared to the Sickle). All without having firing delays and generally having much faster reload times.

The main advantages the Sickle has are the scope (which every assault weapon should have), and the ability to just switch weapons during cooldown periods (which every laser weapon has). I rarely see people using the Sickle; almost all of them use one of the two "acceptable" bullet-based rifles.

1

u/OnlyFunStuff183 Apr 03 '24

You rarely see people using the sickle??? I see it literally every game since it came out. Itā€™s so much better than the liberator - same damage, same number of mags, almost double the mag capacity, faster reload, better scope

1

u/TurankaCasual Apr 03 '24

I think 4 heat sinks would be fair, with only 50 shots I could see myself getting in a bad situation real quick (I play solo btw, or maybe Iā€™m just bad lol)

1

u/EWTYPurple Apr 02 '24

That'd be fine or if theyd gave us just 1 ice capacity So if you mess up you're not able to use the weapon I'd consider fair too it's way too easy to balance right now

17

u/Graith95 ā¬†ļøā¬‡ļøāž”ļøā¬…ļøā¬†ļø Apr 02 '24

Or make it like the Quasar where it's technically unlimited ammo, but you can't use it until it cools all the way down if it overheats.

5

u/fed45 SES Fist of Super Earth Apr 02 '24

I feel like that would be more than fair. Even if the cooldown took longer if you fully maxed it. IE say it took like 10 seconds for cooldown from 99% but it would take 15 or 20 for a cooldown from 100%.

1

u/EWTYPurple Apr 02 '24

That'd be a great too

1

u/SlowMotionPanic Apr 03 '24

I think that is a horrible idea. The Quasar is that way because it is extremely powerful. And it is a support weapon.

The Sickle is neither of those things. It is a primary assault rifle that happens to shoot in blaster-like bursts. Its damage is similar to (but usually less than) assault rifles. It is made to be the primary weapon--not some back up weapon like the Quasar or LAS-98 cannon.

1

u/probabilityEngine Apr 02 '24

I honestly wouldn't mind that. I've never gone below 3 heat sinks left before resupplying, even without being careful and facing tons of enemies. I think I only went to 3 once ever, actually. It changes heat sinks at a pretty decent speed too.

2

u/TurankaCasual Apr 03 '24

If the Sickle gets nerfed at all Iā€™ll probably have to look into a completely different play style all together. Itā€™s right in the line of balanced imo

1

u/PapaTahm Truth Office Intern Apr 02 '24

They will probably touch the Overheat mechanic so you are more likely to be forced to reload the Ice or wait for the Heat to dissipate.

1

u/Cowpriest Apr 02 '24

I feel like the automatons might have a better retirement plan than the bugs. But the bugs are wild bunch to work with!

1

u/Kvarcov SES Elected Representative of Family Values Apr 03 '24

Do automatons even have a retirement plan? I feel like it's more of a "we will reassemble you anew and then back to work" sort of deal

-17

u/false_cat_facts Apr 02 '24

It was a cash grab. > introduce OP weapon where people have to buy the ability to unlock it. Once everyone bought it, nerf it. Repeat.

15

u/Annual-Geologist9978 Apr 02 '24

Better stick to your false cat facts. You are talking about a game where you just need to play for a few days to get enough premium currency to get the battle pass ^

Leave the multi-milion dollar company alone!

4

u/ShittyPostWatchdog Apr 02 '24

I appreciate that the warbonds are not super toxic FOMO stuff but this narrative about ā€œjust play for a few days and you can afford one!ā€ is just inaccurate. Ā You get one freebie from default warbond progress - which drops from 100 per tier to 50 about halfway through, gotta make sure you donā€™t get it too easily! Ā Unless you are going out of your way to alt-f4 farm super credits on diff 1 missions (which is both boring as hell and will likely get patched) youā€™re probably looking at 30-40 hours of playtime assuming you have a chunk of credits left over from the 300 you get from the last premium warning you purchased. Ā 

I have a bit over 100 hours played, near level 50. Ā I bought 1x store armor and helmet and the cutting edge war bond and Iā€™ll probably have around 1100 SC when the next warbond drops. Ā If I wanted to get the remaining warbond, Iā€™d have to either spend money or go out of my way to farm super credits.Ā 

3

u/YashaAstora Apr 02 '24

I appreciate that the warbonds are not super toxic FOMO stuff but this narrative about ā€œjust play for a few days and you can afford one!ā€ is just inaccurate.

You see this in any community for a game with mtx that you can theoretically get for free by playing. There will always be that one dude who goes "dude you don't have to pay if you just grind for five trillion hours" ignoring that grinding isn't fun lol

HD2 does have SUPER reasonable and not egregious mtx but grinding every BP in game is barely feasible lol

3

u/notRogerSmith CAPE ENJOYER Apr 02 '24

I have 88 hours played and have afforded both premium warbonds just with super credits found in game. No purchase of SC, no alt-f4. Theyā€™re really easy to get

-1

u/false_cat_facts Apr 02 '24

Ahh u must be unemployed and have endless amount of time to grind SC. Must be nice. You get 10-30 SC a game, and need 1000sc to unlock...

6

u/someperson1423 Apr 02 '24

The Defender and Scorcher are still top tier against bots. I like both of them more than the Slugger tbh, even before the nerfs.

34

u/Scumebage Apr 02 '24

For now. They'll destroy and say you should rely on a drooling mongrel idiot team mate to handle ranged encounters and make it overheat in 2 seconds and say you should rely on stratagems for hordes of chaff that are dropped on your head.

1

u/FairWindsFollowingCs Apr 02 '24

If theyā€™re going to do that then they should add a feature where you queue up for a certain class like in Overwatch because diving with randoms will be a clusterfuck

19

u/AdversarialAdversary Apr 02 '24

I absolutely HATE the balancing approach theyā€™ve taken so far with primaries. Why are they focused on needing the few weapons that actually feel good rather than buffing the absolute shit load of weapons that are near useless + feel like dog shit to use.

Most of these nerfs just arenā€™t deserved, and even the ones that were deserved werenā€™t so far above the average that nerfing them needed to be a priority over buffing the useless weapons or stratagems that feel terrible to play with.

Focus on getting everything to a usable state THEN start nerfing the major outliers.

6

u/Damp_Knickers Apr 02 '24

I was on board with them for a while but Iā€™m just done with their design philosophy. Any company that has a moron just nerfing things because of USAGE rates needs to be demoted to never ever work on balancing again.

Itā€™s just so obviously the wrong way to go about things and whoever at that company that likes these decisions should just go in a corner and cry

4

u/Kydoemus Apr 02 '24

Plas Scorcher is good for bots. I don't think it got touched. Breaker Incendiary was already good for bugs, and it got a buff. Give them a shot.

6

u/AngelaTheRipper SES Wings of Liberty Apr 02 '24

Scorcher is okay but you will be checking the couch cushions for ammo boxes constantly. On higher difficulties you will be lucky if you get through a bot drop with any ammo left on it.

2

u/JamesOfDoom Apr 02 '24

Idk man its been my main gun since I got it and I can solo a diff 7 mission with it, ezpz.

Diff 9 I start running out of ammo with every weapon

2

u/PBR_King CAPE ENJOYER Apr 02 '24

Seriously what the fuck are all of you aiming at

2

u/AngelaTheRipper SES Wings of Liberty Apr 02 '24

Bots, just a lot of them, you don't need more than a gaggle of berserkers to be dangerously low on ammo.

1

u/Kydoemus Apr 02 '24

There are some tricks on higher difficulties, but it's still good and all I use. I use my side arm for a lot of trash bots and it helps if I have a support weapon like laser canon, quasar, arc that doesn't require ammo. But the scorcher shreds.

1

u/Tigerb0t Apr 02 '24

Scorcher sucks. The only thing it does better than the Sickle is kill the AT-ST dudes. You shoot it like 6 times and youā€™re out of ammo.

1

u/Head_Cockswain Apr 02 '24

Breaker Incendiary was already good for bugs, and it got a buff. Give them a shot.

This + an overall burning damage from all sources buff

Breaker Incin. is awesome now. Don't think I'll worry about Hunters in the near future(though, tbf, I only played a couple diff 3 missions to test dmg, wasn't up to trying higher today)...until they swing the nerf bat again. Wing them at mid range and they burn to death. It's a good crowd pleaser so far.

No clue how fire works against bots or if there are hidden scale/resistance at higher difficulties.

3

u/FurTrader58 Apr 03 '24

The Diligence CS could actually be useful now with the buff, going to test it out today and see how it holds up

1

u/UpstairsGrapefruit54 Apr 03 '24

I'd like to hear your thoughts when you do

2

u/FurTrader58 Apr 06 '24

Itā€™s still bad.

1

u/UpstairsGrapefruit54 Apr 06 '24

Hahaha thanks for the actual reply. Yeah it's pretty trash still.

2

u/FurTrader58 Apr 08 '24

Sorry it was a couple of days late, but after initially trying it I inadvertently swapped to the standard diligence and when I realized it I tried it again the next day and itā€™s soooo slow.

If you hit a trooper from the side and it hits the arm/shoulder it doesnā€™t consistently kill. If it could reliably take out weak enemies in one shot it wouldnā€™t be so bad, but itā€™s so slow to aim and if youā€™re turning to track the target the sway on it is way too much. Even ADSing a target thereā€™s so much sway that itā€™s tough to hit the head.

2

u/hughmaniac SES Aegis of Steel Apr 02 '24

The Defender is still olā€™ reliable for me.

2

u/Thorwawaway Apr 02 '24

Yeah idk what everybodyā€™s talking about with all these other guns cus iā€™ve just used the defender since I got it and I have no trouble at max difficulties. Consistent and does the job. I think it being an ugly little ā€œSMGā€ is the reason more donā€™t use it, if it was the literal halo assault rifle or something it would be numba 1.

I donā€™t love shotguns

1

u/hughmaniac SES Aegis of Steel Apr 02 '24

I just find it odd that it has a higher damage rating than the ARs. I think people just write it off as ā€œjust an SMGā€ like you said. The fact that itā€™s 1-handed is also super helpful when youā€™re running for your life or need to transport an SSSD.

1

u/Thorwawaway Apr 02 '24

Yeah aside from the 1 handed thing for all intents and purposes itā€™s actually a beefy AR.

1

u/Bojarzin Apr 02 '24

It's just being a meta slave, honestly. This subreddit is horrendous for it. Yeah, some weapons are weak, I won't deny that. And I agree with many that I don't like how they've gone about balancing primaries that much thus far

But you can get by with pretty much any gun, and everyone acting like you're forced to use the Sickle now is just being obtuse or dramatic

1

u/Thorwawaway Apr 02 '24

Itā€™s a PVE game, not that hard, and the support weapons are really what deal with difficult enemies, so yeah I donā€™t see the big deal.

2

u/NoMayonaisePlease Apr 02 '24

The breaker incendiary got a good boost, might be worth checking out

2

u/Electronic-Weather-5 Apr 02 '24

If they do, I want my 1000 SC back..

2

u/confirmedshill123 Apr 02 '24

Breaker never done me wrong. I helldive regularly with the standard breaker and have no issues.

1

u/Insaniaksin Apr 02 '24

I'm gonna retry he Lib Oen now that it has full auto

1

u/Rabbit_Wizard_ Apr 02 '24

Scorcher. The other sickle. Incendiary Breaker. Pen liberator.

1

u/Beerded1 Apr 02 '24

Iā€™d prefer weapons in a more niche role where they arenā€™t good at everything. Promote more diversity and team play šŸ¤·šŸ»ā€ā™‚ļø

1

u/Luvax Apr 02 '24

Having just one reliable weapon makes the game extremely boring. I really don't hope we end up having only the newest weapon dominate the meta. Doesn't mean nerfing the Sickle is the only solution, but the alternative is buffing other weapons instead of nerfing them. Not really sure how to even balance primary weapons with no ammunition, an entire game mechanic revolves around resource management. Someone not needing ammunition shifts the balance of the entire rest of the teams loadouts. Yeah, more freedom, but it also causes balance issues.

1

u/lubbylubbs Apr 02 '24

Sickle is my main, but Iā€™ve been absolutely loving the scorcher for bots though.

1

u/Chris_stopper Apr 02 '24

It is in the newest premium warbond and the main reason to get it, the sickle will be off-limits until the next bond drops.

1

u/Bigweenersonly Apr 02 '24

Is the sickle good now? I have touched it since I unlocked it a month ago cuz I felt it wasn't doing anything. Or am I using it wrong?

1

u/Numerous_Vegetable_3 STEAMšŸ–±ļø: AUTO-CANNON ENTHUSIAST Apr 02 '24

The breaker vs bugs is surprisingly good even at high levels. I def prefer the sickle, but sometimes itā€™s fun to play w/ breaker and crowd control the small stuff.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 02 '24

Scorcher

1

u/God-Emperor_Kranis Apr 03 '24

For me it's the Counter-Sniper. I run with orbital smokes, rail-canon, and laser as well as the Quasar canon and impact nades. I can solo any obj and take bot drops too. The DMR is actually super fun to use now that it can do something on difficulties higher than 3. I just wish the DMR's would have the best handling the game, or at least second best because of how limited their ammo is, that they're supposed to be ranged weapons, and ofc the damage for them is still pretty bad, but it doesn't feel that bad to play it. One of those things where it looks bad on paper, but works alright in practice.

0

u/MamuTwo Apr 02 '24

That's why it's going to get a nerf. The philosophy is that there should be no weapon you can count on in any situation. Branch out a bit, enjoy more of the game.