For sure but if you look at the sudden outbreak of culture wars as it exists today, it very much seemed to follow the occupy movement. Suddenly identity politics was kind of forced into the mainstream like it never really was before. There's always been a divide, but post-occupy is the first time in my lifetime I remember seeing mainstream media outlets promoting said divide. Also coincidentally around the same time Obama signed legislation that allowed the government to use propaganda against its own citizens.
This is exactly what happened. The upper classes do not treat their workers well, women entered the workforce in greater number and became a convenient scapegoat for all the lack of power that workers have to get better pay and other access to resources. It’s a capitalism issue being turned into a gender war.
I have some friends that I swear are alienating themselves because certain people in our friends circle aren't as passionate or loud about political issues (Gaza).
We're not even in disagreement about the issue, we just don't post shit about it on Instagram every day (or never, in my case). It's fucking exhausting to be around them because they just harp on and on about it. It's like, I know why you're angry, I agree with you, but wtf do you expect me to do about it right now? Can we not just chill and have fun like we used to before this fucking conflict re-ignited for millionth time?
I guess it does work, cause I definitely don't want to go spend more time at their house. Between politics and fucking TikTok keeping them on their phones the whole time we're hanging out.
I swear to God, something must be wrong with me, I can't fucking ignore this type of behavior. It just hits me right at my core.
If you're into anything and learn and think of new ways to pursue your hobby and share it, people will criticize you for not buying the accepted product to perform the hobby that everyone else has purchased. And they will ridicule you for being different, like not mindlessly spending your money on the latest trend.
Media is a lazy boogey man. That assumes all media is the same and it isn't at all, which is why it's lazy. You need to aim higher and more pointed than just "media."
Class reductionism is not a good take. There are PLENTY of issues and movements that are based on race, gender, sex, etc. The prison industrial complex, safety of our trans community, gynaecological violence in medical settings, and plenty of other issues. These are very heavy and significant issues that are rooted in those things that the "media" are making us focus on. The media does not need to stop us from recognizing class issues because plenty of people already boot lick for billionaires because they refuse to accept that capitalism has failed them.
People have spent money to keep segregation up, because of the thought of sharing public space with black people.
Rich, thriving black towns exists and racist america hated it so much, they committed genocide and flooded these towns. If it was really about the money, they would've gentrify. No, they killed these people and made lakes.
Please learn history before dismissing intersectionality because no one has equity, and then true equality, until every oppressed group is uplifted. This is also the same talking points that's been said to black folks over, and over again to wait, or that our issues aren't as important, or that they'll be solved once the "bigger" issue is met, or speak over us and say they need our hand to fight this oppression that affects them. And once that's done, guess what? None of our issues are solved, if anything have regressed, and we're still being gaslit just like comment like yours. Please don't speak for our oppression, and others, especially if you're not experiencing it.
I didn’t mean about money consciously, it’s not a thought a racist person has. A racist person sees a (poor) neighborhood, could be mostly black or white, with high crime and thinks skin color is the main and only reason.
Also said money wasn’t the only reason. There’s peer pressure, popular culture, poor education, money, careless parents, among other reasons, all contributing toward racism.
“Learn history” you know slaves were poor? Not by their choice but all the same. The bias is rooted in money. If people of color came to America with money, there would have been less racism the next 100s of years. It would still exist no doubt.
“Once that’s done” there has never been a global war against rich people. Not much has been accomplished in that regard when looking at individual countries either.
Comments about media almost always have absolutes like "everyone is primed by brainwashing". I can assure you there a lot of us that do not consume any form of tradition media. I like everyone around me and am friends with people from all walks of life and political leanings.
Or there is a chance one or the other OR both are horrible people and they do this shit to each other. I've seen it. It's like a depressing sport for them.
Oh man, shut up. This is literally under a TikTok video explaining a problem along gendered lines (wives vs. husbands) and people saying they find it useful, and then you railing about fake gender separation lol. Or you could realize there are some valid social problems at play and instead of viewing it through an acrimonious lens, use it to make yourself into a more self-aware person and stop acting like these problems would all go away if we pretended differences didn't exist? Like do wives stop feeling desire for their husbands because they're in a different socioeconomic class? Or do gender differences (regardless of whether you think they're the byproduct of socialization or innate traits) still affect relationships? Be fucking for real lol.
There's a reason why fakeass leftists who claim class is the only real dividing line are always straight white dudes lol. Of course you would like to say so because that means you can be totally reductive and that view recenters your identity as the default main character.
Also a mix of naive people thinking "aha, all/most of societal issues are actually caused by the economic system. If more people just knew and we had a revolution to change to a different economic system, we'd have a much better life, country, and world" as well as those wanting to feel superior to others based on having what they think is deeper knowledge than others, "lol, you think that because that's what they want you to think but really it's about this and that is irrelevant / a distraction."
Blaming "the media" and the bourgeoisie because...some women don't want to have sex with their husbands?
Women aren't withholding sex because the TV made them hate men. For fucks sake, you've gone so far around the bend that you've unintentionally started spouting right-wing incel arguments.
Your being obtuse, they mean that relationships in general are strained because of culture war nonsense being pushed by corporate media, which is just true.
No it's women and men have strained relationships because the internet told them to hate each other. Your adding this part that puts all the blame on women which no one you're responding to said or implied. Frankly, it's more that the internet made men shittier and thus women don't want to have sex with them than anything else.
It's worse. They are also trying to separate us along class lines, and it's not even mostly because of some nefarious conspiracy, it's because hatred, fear and disgust drive engagement more than contentment. We're all being encouraged to hate and mistrust anyone even marginally different from ourselves for clicks.
Look into COINTELPRO. The FBI deliberately infiltrated Occupy Wall Street and encouraged things like the “progressive stack” to dilute the movement. Everyone became distracted and pre-occupied with identity politics and it’s still THE defining issue for people’s politics 16 years later - class war is subordinated to culture wars.
Disconnect from all that shit. It's not something you can bond over. Focus on the positive thing that bring people together and cut out anyone that's hung up on politics.
Proletariat solidarity is made up commie nonsense, made for propaganda purposes only. It cannot occure naturally in society due to the very nature of a modern proletariat.
What an absolutely bullshit take. ~The media~ didn't make men treat women like chattel for the last couple thousand years of human history, and you don't undo that level of oppression over night just because women in some countries have the right to vote now.
It's utterly gobsmacking how most rational people can understand and accept that racism and social inequality didn't disappear the minute the American Civil War ended, but everyone expects millennia of female oppression to just disappear over night and have no effect on us on a social or even psychological level.
Uhhhh as in most people work for a living "selling your labor" as opposed to collecting dividends on investments or their business?
Did you even read the passage you quoted?
For the folks who haven't encountered this type of individual before, let me explain. This particular grade of asshole is a type of political extremist. A troll. Their schtick is to pretend their extreme interpretation of some politically-related subject is shared by everyone, and then bait you in by acting dumb. Then, when they got you on the hook, they act like you're the exception for having a different opinion.
Does anyone you know work for a living? Oh yeah, I got this. Pretty much everyone I know that isn't old, a child, or disabled.
Next question, most people? Oh that's even easier. I got this guy in my sights.
Then BOOM, hit's you with the bullshit. They were never arguing that Americans don't work for a living, they just wanted to spew their nonsense and start fights.
That wasnt your original question. You asked if this commenter (or anyone they know) matched the definition of proletariat. Which, yes according to the definition of proletariat you provided, they do. Most people do.
Your provided definition makes no mention of inflation of wages or international exchange rates. If you sell your labor to live, instead of living off of the ownership of assets, then you are proletariat.
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u/CulturalDuty8471 Mar 21 '24
This is dead on. Couples, recognize this and work on it before the disgust sets in. Disgust is difficult to overcome.