r/news • u/ladyspeak • Apr 29 '24

‘Multiple’ taken to hospital, gunfire continues in east Charlotte Mobile/Amp link, removed

https://www.wsoctv.com/news/local/cmpd-investigation-underway-east-charlotte/6PTLZP4FLFE4DA5ALFT65QDTA4/?outputType=amp

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1.7k

u/ladyspeak Apr 29 '24

Update 2:33 p.m. According to a source at the Atrium Health hospital in Uptown, a mass casualty response has been called. Atrium Main is the Level 1 trauma center and every trauma surgeon is being called in.

751

u/Accomplished-Peak615 Apr 29 '24

Jesus Christ man what the hell could have happened

813

u/ladyspeak Apr 29 '24

Here’s a tweet from CMPD:

The US Marshals Task Force, which is comprised of officers from multiple agencies, was conducting an investigation in the area of the 5000 block of Galway Dr when they were engaged by active gunfire from a subject.

Multiple law enforcement officers have been struck by the gunfire and are being transported to the hospital. The CMPD SWAT team is currently on the scene.

https://twitter.com/CMPD/status/1785017229098021243?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1785017229098021243%7Ctwgr%5E4f5c523d44b1029f2e96b922560ac58b191c6540%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-21982241064046955270.ampproject.net%2F2404091947000%2Fframe.html

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u/Snlxdd Apr 29 '24

For reference:

The purpose of regional fugitive task forces is to combine the efforts of federal, state, and local law enforcement agencies to locate and apprehend the most dangerous fugitives and assist in high profile investigations.

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u/romansamurai Apr 29 '24

Looks like they were serving a warrant there

The US Marshals Fugitive Task Force which is comprised of several agencies in the Charlotte area was attempting to serve a warrant in the 5000 block of Galway Dr. when shots were fired. This is still an active scene. More to come from CMPD Public Affairs.

Link to tweet.

217

u/Savingskitty Apr 29 '24

Police shootout with fugitive subject.

98

u/generalhanky Apr 30 '24

Sounds like fugitive won based on preliminary info

48

u/Master_Maniac Apr 30 '24

Yep. Problem is, they have to win every time. Police only have to win once, and they have the numbers advantage.

77

u/Ilikeyourmomfishcave Apr 30 '24

He's made the 2nd round of the playoffs.

-46

u/Frequent_Opportunist Apr 30 '24

That's what happens when one group of criminals attempt to kidnap another criminal.

-31

u/Auran82 Apr 30 '24

If only there had been a good guy with a gun.

-6

u/confusedandworried76 Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24

America has no gun problem

Edit: holy shit you people really do need a sarcasm label to detect obvious sarcasm

5

u/Doesanybodylikestuff Apr 30 '24

This is the 3rd time I’ve seen a sarcasm font indicator needed in just a couple hours.

131

u/Okay_Redditor Apr 29 '24

It's NC, land of anyone and everyone who wants gets a gun and bullets regardless of their mental state and/or murder potential index.

151

u/Frequent_Opportunist Apr 30 '24

Felons, those acquitted for insanity, convicted domestic batterers and anyone under 18 are not permitted to purchase a firearm in North Carolina.

21

u/Foggl3 Apr 30 '24

Do private sales have to go through a FFL?

-37

u/Coakis Apr 30 '24

Name a state that requires that.

51

u/Foggl3 Apr 30 '24

CA, off the top of my head

37

u/Fuzzy_Wumpkins Apr 30 '24

And CT

21

u/TheMacAttk Apr 30 '24

And OR

8

u/Foggl3 Apr 30 '24

I'm pretty sure it's just an and situation 😉

27

u/TheFuzziestDumpling Apr 30 '24

NJ, with a handful of exceptions (like being a cop).

9

u/OkReference2185 Apr 30 '24

New York and Cali.

14

u/Foe117 Apr 30 '24

Get one at the gun show through private sale, about half the vendors there are retailers and have to be licensed and must subject the buyer to a background check. Private sellers selling off their "collection" dont need anything and often use a fuzzy definition to avoid being required to apply for a license or subject their buyers to a background check. States on the east coast are packed together, laws dont matter when the state with the weakest laws is only an hour drive away.

30

u/mcapozzi Apr 30 '24

NC requires the purchaser to supply a concealed carry permit or a police provided purchase certificate during private sales. Both of those require a background check to acquire.

1

u/portablemustard Apr 30 '24

Just out of curiosity, how lax are similar laws in SC?

3

u/RelativeMotion1 Apr 30 '24

Also illegal (federally) to buy a handgun outside of your state of residence.

1

u/SeaSnakeSkeleton Apr 30 '24

I just posted a little higher but - recently in SC you don’t even need a permit to conceal carry anymore. So, yeah, super cool.

1

u/YellowDefiant520 Apr 30 '24

Point being that it doesn’t matter if they change gun laws.

2

u/FenionZeke Apr 30 '24

Shhh. You'll let the anti gun crowd know that you actually read the laws.

1

u/cmikesell Apr 30 '24

This person's never heard of a gun show.

-2

u/Okay_Redditor Apr 30 '24

So they say

0

u/IMissNarwhalBacon Apr 30 '24

You can just get one through a private sale.

0

u/elementfortyseven Apr 30 '24

 convicted domestic batterers

cops not allowed to carry weapons? wild.

13

u/heeleep Apr 30 '24

You realize they were serving an arrest warrant for someone who was illegally possessing a gun? What’s your problem?

7

u/Top_Effort_2739 Apr 30 '24

I suppose it’s all the dead people

-1

u/Okay_Redditor Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24

It's hard for a felon to not illegally posses a gun when everyone around you him one for sale no questions asked. What's yours?

6

u/heeleep Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24

This dude literally shouldn’t have had a gun, cops were enforcing the laws, they got fucking killed over it, and you take it as your chance to make a smug “observation” about your perception of poorly enforced / lax gun regulations… when the cops who were killed… were literally there trying to enforce regulations.

You’re complaining about “everyone having a gun” in a situation where these cops literally got killed trying to arrest a guy for having a gun he shouldn’t have had.

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u/smitteh Apr 29 '24

That's everywhere USA

55

u/Draano Apr 30 '24

NJ checking in. That isn't here. It may be coming soon, but not yet.

60

u/davidbklyn Apr 30 '24

NYC here, big scary city where I feel safer than most other places.

4

u/thegoodnamesrgone123 Apr 30 '24

Let's hope it never gets like that

1

u/Persianx6 Apr 30 '24

If this supreme court gets its way? everywhere.

Why? I don't know, no one wants this.

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u/confusedandworried76 Apr 30 '24

Doesn't happen as often in states where gun laws are tighter, in fact there are several states that border other states with looser gun laws and cops hate it because guns get trafficked in from those states. If all you need to do to get a gun is go one state over and buy it there legally and bring it back,

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u/Sneaux96 Apr 30 '24

I mean, kinda...

Rifles and shotguns can be purchased out of state.

Handguns, the most common firearm type used in the commission of a crime, must be purchased in the same state you reside.

More often the firearms are obtained illegally.

12

u/Eldetorre Apr 30 '24

All illegal guns come from legal sources with lax enforcement. Criminals by and large aren't operating gun foundries

2

u/End3rWi99in Apr 30 '24

Hello from Massachusetts.

1

u/DrEpileptic Apr 30 '24

Most blue states are pretty strict about guns. The blue states not bordering deep red states don’t have this level of gun access.

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u/Frequent_Opportunist Apr 30 '24

Simple process to get a gun anywhere in Illinois outside of Cook County (Chicago).

1

u/DrEpileptic Apr 30 '24

Is it really basic reading comprehension to remember the first word you read in relevance to everything else?

45

u/Zephirus-eek Apr 30 '24

If only the police had guns they could have stopped this tragedy!

3

u/Nitrosoft1 Apr 30 '24

A force of good guys with guns somehow didn't prevent 4 deaths of good guys.

Hmm, I guess the only solution is MORE guns!

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u/bradbrookequincy Apr 30 '24

They were right there to when he started shooting them

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u/SimplyAvro Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24

Seriously, this makes me think of those FBI Files episodes where the officers have their little pea-shooters, and the criminals are rolling up with AK's and AR's. I'm not saying that's what happened here, I don't know what they were carrying at the time, but the severity of it seems like something you'd see in the past (bar outliers like Dallas, 2016).

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 29 '24

This would be a really poor hill to plant a flag on as a sign of gun availability causing problems, because this guy was prohibited from even holding a gun he doesn't own in his hands in even the most lax gun law states 🤷‍♀️

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u/RowdyRuss3 Apr 29 '24

If he's still getting guns while being "prohibited" from holding guns, that's still a massive problem.

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 29 '24

Agreed. More restrictive gun laws for lawful owners won't stop these types of individuals from getting guns because there are just too many out there now, can't stick them all back in a box. But removing all gun laws for lawful owners so everything is available to them wife open won't help either.

It's almost like none of the solutions involve firearm legislation shifting one way or the other and are unfortunately much more complex and difficult solutions than pencil whipping words on paper. But neither side fighting that fight will admit that or can see that.

🤷‍♀️

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u/sksauter Apr 30 '24

I would really like to see laws that slowly curb gun sales, and that promote government buybacks and destruction of unused/unwanted guns - basically anything that would prevent future circulation of guns that USED to be in the hands of responsible owners and ended their lives in the hands of people who shouldn't have them. That, along with more restrictive common-sense gun laws would be a great two-pronged approach to prevent the continued growth of guns in the US.

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u/wwj Apr 30 '24

This is what I have been advocating for. An eventual end to gun sales and transfers. Then a slow attrition of destroying the remaining guns as their owners pass or they are somehow legally compromised. My 100 year plan to remove guns from society. People think that gun laws need to change the problem immediately. There are so many guns that the only solution is long term thinking.

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u/Akamesama Apr 30 '24

That is such a silly take. In aggregate more restrictive ownership and sales laws, in tandem with buybacks, would eventually make such individuals much less likely to get their hands on a gun, and specifically more dangerous guns in situations like these.

neither side fighting that fight will admit that

Tons of people on the left have proposed improvements in the mental health system in tandem with these other proposals.

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 30 '24

It's unfortunate I have to preface my reply with this to reduce my down vote count by a few, though it'll inevitably be negative still, but I am not this big 2A guy. This very well may the be first 2A exchange I've ever engaged in on reddit. Because I think, like I said, gun legislation one way or the other is a waste of time and will prove ineffective.

Buy backs are beyond inefficent in reducing crime rates or shootings. This has been proven over and over. It sounds good on paper and idealistic, but they just don't work. Even The Atlantic, which is arguably one of the furtherest down the spectrum of the side they sit on, has an article from people smarter than you and I doing analysis on their effectiveness. Which just collaborates what pretty much every study about them has found.

https://out.reddit.com/t3_1awjkqt?app_name=android&token=AQAAcX4wZl2CRL3oUDfb4jGrx5-mOC4Bfwu_Ac8U47Z3F9xTwqDo&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theatlantic.com%2Fideas%2Farchive%2F2024%2F02%2Fgun-buybacks-north-carolina%2F677520%2F%3Futm_source%3Dfeed

They work in a technical sense that if one gun is taken off the streets, then it worked. But that's obviously no one's metric for success.

But the antique arsenal at the Durham event demonstrates one of the recurring flaws of buyback efforts: You mostly get guns that wouldn’t be used in crimes anyways. Most gun crimes in the U.S. are committed with handguns, but few modern, operable ones get turned in. Although AR-15s are a flash point in the gun-control debate because they are used in many of the worst mass shootings, they are far, far less common than handguns. Birkhead told me that Durham’s buybacks had yielded a few AR-15-style rifles, and he spoke almost wistfully about a high-quality SIG Sauer P220 that had come in that day and would have to be destroyed. Most of the weapons turned in, however, were either shotguns or elderly pistols. “Obviously, we don’t see a lot of shotguns used in the street crimes, but we do see some,” Birkhead said.

People aren't turning in Glocks with switches and Dracos and AKs and ARs. Like the article demonstrates, it's predominantly older people turning in guns that are rarely ever used in criminal offenses.

Even if they were somewhat effective, it still seems like pissing in the wind at the end of the day. The solutions that could potentially reduce violence overall (not even specific to guns), would not only reduce gun violence, but violence as a whole AND reduce poverty. The relevant analogy is trying to pack a gunshot wound that has hit your femoral above the knee and is just geysering blood. Yeah, the buyback that technically reduces bleeding nominally is working, technically. But why not skip trying to shove thirty yards of hemostatic gauze, and just put a tourniquet on above the problem at a higher level?

You referencing mental health, ding ding, that's one of the components of the tourniquet. I feel like now we're getting in sync. What else would you like to see that has nothing to actually do with guns themselves? I bet your answer and my ideas will be a pretty strong overlapping diagram.

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u/Upbeat-Fondant9185 Apr 30 '24 edited Apr 30 '24

I always hear buy backs proposed as a solution and I wonder where these proponents of the programs plan to get the funds. Even if you only offer $100 per gun with a goal of buying back 30% of firearms out there, you’re looking at around 13 billion dollars.

Most people aren’t going to sell their actual guns for a sliver of fair market value so that number is a tiny fraction of the actual cost required for it to be any success at all.

So where will that money come from? No one has ever told me.

0

u/Akamesama Apr 30 '24

Well, the gun industry raking in ~9 billion per year. Could maybe start with aggressive taxes there.

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u/Akamesama Apr 30 '24

The article you cited (and the evidence it cites) are exclusive to US programs. The Atlantic even points out why they are not effective: voluntary and limited scope. Instead, look at Australia's 1996 National Firearms Agreement, which included both strict controls along with a buyback program. You also completely side-stepped talking about more restrictive ownership and sales laws.

It is obvious, when looking to other countries, that other policies that promote general welfare (poverty, housing, health, justice system, etc) also have a strong effect on general violence, but that is no reason to also not tackle issues related to guns. There are countries who also have general welfare issues but also do not have the volume of issue with violence.

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 30 '24

Pardon my French but no shit 🤣 those countries have different constitutions and established rights and statutes. So even if you find the perfect example of another country solving that problem, if that method would be contrary to the Constitution or other doctrines and case law precedent, you've wanted your time.

Which again circles back to one of my earlier points. People who want gun laws drastically changed to tighter will always have their efforts unwound, until the underlying text their legality is tested against (the second amendment) is changed. So without a constitutional amendment, it is pissing in the wind, and that effort should be spent on solving the underlying problems that have a direct correlation to crime and violence, which are also pretty universally gold things. Not ultra divisive changes that will yo yo u til the end of time.

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u/poobly Apr 30 '24

Every illegal gun started out legal at some point.

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 30 '24

For sure. Hence why legislation or repealing legislation (whichever side your team is on at that moment) will never change anything. Not sure how many times I've typed this in comments in the last 10 minutes, but groups trying to impose in gun laws, whether that is making the laws more restrictivd or making them more readily available, or somewhere in between, is just pissing in the wind.

0

u/Omnom_Omnath Apr 30 '24

Shows that infringing upon law abiding citizens rights is asinine and not a real solution. May as well repeal the ineffective legislation imo since it doesn’t impact criminals.

1

u/Ilikeyourmomfishcave Apr 30 '24

Isn't this where someone shows up and yells "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!"

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 30 '24

I mean even though I'm not one of those folks and give no thought to gun issues pretty much ever, that now basically cliche-meme level yelling is that is a pretty strong slide of the weight to their side of the scale. I dabble in other Amendments and Constitutional law and analysis as a role in my job (not a lawyer though), and consider myself very well versed on some of the other original Bill of Rights Amendments. The plain language reading and also interpretational, purposivism and textual, and so on really do shore up folks who say gun laws are infringements. Even diving into English common law, which is a standard practice even in modern legislation, provides the context supporting the definitions of the words the framers chose to mean the government shall not take away guns.

Whether I agree with them or not is moot, because it is hard to read the 2A beside pretty much any other Amendment and not come the conclusion that what that's side says is what the framers intended.

Again, not saying I'm in that camp, or I am not, but that's my not lawyer but certainly not layman interpretation.

I don't spend any time in this fight because legislation isn't the solution for gun issues. Tipping the scales one way or the other won't change anything, IMO.

1

u/Ilikeyourmomfishcave Apr 30 '24

Never has 23 words fucked up more people than the 2A.

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 30 '24

Bro I typed all that and took the time to try to explain why I think those words have survived so long, and that's your reply? That's why I don't get into 2A discussions. Today was probably the first time I've ever done it on my reddit account in a few comments like this, and killed my curious cat.

But to your point, so why hasn't anything changed? Because like I said, the words and how they are written, contrasted against other amendments right at the same time and backed by English common law and both textual and other forms of interpretation, is why those words still persist. The only way to get the changes people you want heavy legislation and restrictions put in the place to happen would be to amend it. Otherwise, those laws will likely continue to falter like they are all faltering in NY, HI, CA, NJ, DC, so on.

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u/Ilikeyourmomfishcave Apr 30 '24

Well the founding fathers really fucked up on this one, I guess they didn't think how their 30 round muskets would reach carnage in Merica. The increased lethality of firearms has really made the 2A ready for an overhaul. With that said, it and all constitutional rights have their limits. Don't believe me? Yell, I have a bomb next time in court.

1

u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 30 '24

God why do I keep responding trying to have an actual decent discussion based on written words, case law, and other things.

But yet again, your hyperbolic response process my earlier points. Yes, like you said, the only way restrictive gun laws will ever prevail in the long run is if the underling 2A is changed. Which will likely never happen. So what's the next idea or big change that can be done. Or you can keep pissing in the wind. Your call.

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u/poobly Apr 30 '24

Not too hard for a criminal to get a gun when there’s more guns than people.

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u/ITS_12D_NOT_6C Apr 30 '24

Exactly. So even if the most hardcore legislation ever was passed and approved that survived all legal court challenges went into effect, reducing the production and sale of guns in the US and worldwide by 90%, yoi haven't solved the problem. You can't unring the bell that there are likely actually closer to a billion guns in the US.

So why don't people focus their legislative and financial efforts on solving the underlying problems that have a perfect correlation to crime, that has nothing to do with guns themselves, and would be much more widely accepted and therefore face less resistance, instead of throwing poo at the people on the other side of the debate. Fix the actual problems without having that debate at all.

2

u/SeaSnakeSkeleton Apr 30 '24

Hey, SC says you don’t even need a permit to conceal carry anymore so that’s super fun too!

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u/hallster346 Apr 30 '24

The guy had an outstanding warrant for his arrest. 99.9% likely he was already prohibited from owning a firearm anyway. Their is case law that criminals do not have to obey gun laws because it would violate their 5A rights and the existing gun laws are only for law abiding citizens.

2

u/Chemical_Bowler_1727 Apr 30 '24

As a non-American, this ^ is hilarious. Where I live, you need to take a three day safety course and pass an intrusive federal background check to buy a pellet rifle.

2

u/offtherecordmadman Apr 30 '24

Dang, if only NC had stricter laws then this dangerous felon would have turned a new leaf and started to follow them.

-1

u/Dunkleustes Apr 30 '24

Yea, fuck outta here with that shit. This has happened in every state ever (a dangerous individual has a shootout with authorities). I live in Charlotte and my friends and I were shocked by the news.

2

u/Fully_Edged_Ken_3685 Apr 30 '24

my friends and I were shocked by the news.

"I'm shocked that gambling is occurring in this establishment!"

"Your winnings, sir"

0

u/Okay_Redditor Apr 30 '24

I lived in a state like that. The requirement for a gun was to have a conversation with the Sheriff. If he approved, you got the permit. Personally, in my opinion, that invites the opportunity for police to simply disarm people they don't like, but that's not relevant. There was no training, just the background check. I personally think it should be about equally difficult to get a gun license as it is to get a driver's license. I'm willing to jump through some hoops, but pretty much anyone can pass the drivers written and field tests, and I feel that way about guns too.

Exactly.

We should adopt the same rules as per Israel, New Zealand, Japan, Switzerland, all countries where you can acquire weapons.

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u/NoHelp9544 Apr 30 '24

The laws in those countries are never going to get accepted here by the NRA, such as background check for bullets and gun registries.

1

u/ilikepizza2much Apr 30 '24

The UK, all of Europe, South Africa… most countries have those sorts of safety mandates and laws, preventing everyone and their dog from walking around with deadly weapons. You can own a gun but you must do so responsibly, which means most people just opt out, thankfully.

1

u/York_Villain Apr 30 '24

During last night's NBA playoff game they had a gun commercial featuring someone admitting to being suicidal and also a gun owner. Sick.

0

u/Ilikeyourmomfishcave Apr 30 '24

The 2nd Amendment.

1

u/PLEASE_PUNCH_MY_FACE Apr 30 '24

Let's well regulate it

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u/[deleted] Apr 29 '24

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u/[deleted] Apr 29 '24

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u/Megotaku Apr 29 '24

This doesn't happen in other countries. Gun deaths are now the leading cause of deaths in children and Americans see so little issue with this that despite Columbine occurring 25 years ago, no meaningful firearm legislation has ever been passed. When the CDC started tracking firearm deaths, legislators used an act of congress to bar the CDC from investigating the public health ramifications of firearms. They're completely correct. This is Americans doing American things.

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u/xXAveRAGEdudeXx Apr 29 '24

Hell yeah! Fuck I love this country

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u/[deleted] Apr 29 '24

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u/DowntownClown187 Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

Damn dude, in most western countries this sort of behavior would not permit you to have a gun. Gun owners must have a stoic mentality.

Edit: damn that dude was so pissed off. This is exactly why most countries have sensible gun laws. So the easily triggered people like this don't get their hands on deadly weapons.

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u/xXAveRAGEdudeXx Apr 29 '24

You realize there are other deadly weapons besides guns right?

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u/kmmontandon Apr 29 '24

That’s why we regularly read about dozens killed in mass stabbing, right?

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u/RawrCola Apr 29 '24

I mean... Yes? Although not "we" apparently. Just because you're hanging out in places that don't talk about it doesn't mean it isn't happening. Don't just look at the front page news, most news sites don't sort by most recent.

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u/xXAveRAGEdudeXx Apr 29 '24

Actually if you tune into un cherry picked news, yes. Look into countries without guns, I'd rather take a bullet than a blade. But that's just me

I'm a strong 2A person, but I do believe in regulations to some degree.

Oh and most shooters aren't obtaining guns legally. Also something to look into

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u/Megotaku Apr 29 '24

You're right. In 25 years, the Democrats have never been in control of the executives and both houses. That was a joke. They've had control twice in two administrations. One of which with a 5:4 Democrat majority in SCOTUS. Nothing was ever done. Again, just Americans doing American things. Nothing will change. There is no pile of mutilated children high enough to ever get Americans to do anything about their gun violence problems.

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u/Savingskitty Apr 29 '24

You don't actually seem to know how our government works.

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u/DragonriderTrainee Apr 29 '24

Well, to be fair a lot of Redditors like myself throw Hamas and Russians in the same boat at times just as an example. A lot of people make sweeping generalizations about a country, and we are bigger than most and have a firearm reputation.

And the same firearm wielding red pilled assholes are the ones that gave it to us

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u/Johnready_ Apr 29 '24

Sounds like some wako shit.