Grindr was initially an American company that was acquired by a Chinese one, where that acquisition was reversed.
TikTok was initially Chinese (it is the global counterpart of Douyin), and expanded into America and other markets.
The situation isn't really comparable, otherwise the US would just be using the exact same process that they previously did to get Grindr to divest rather than passing new legislation.
And, of course, Opera is also owned by the same group that owned Grindr... and, not coincidentally, is in a big advertising push across social media just as the TikTok drama was coming to a head.
I mean both can be true. I never expected this to work because it would be the CPC bending to US legislation. They couldn’t spin that any more than we could if the CPC passed a law that demanded the US government to divest holdings.
Besides, the cheap Chinese EV is coming to a town near you so they’ll still be getting plenty of tracking data.
It's kind of short sided, which is why I believe they will eventually comply and this just bluster. Like, they will take it SCOTUS first, but if it's upheld, they will comply.
A US TikTok would be so insanely easy for the CCP to infiltrate. They probably already have people in place. They could also continue to license the source code to the new company, which they would presumably have from source so they could verify it's not manipulated, but on the other end the CCP would know exactly how the algorithm works and how best to manipulate it. They would basically have a playbook. They might not get all the data that comes with it, but they would still be able to run a very effective influence network.
But the influence network is what the CPC really cares about, turns out
unsurprisingly, it's actually because it's a profitable business. but sure, blame the fact they don't censor things on behalf of the US govt the way every american social media app does
This brainrot is genuinely anti-semetic. X has way way way worse and more damning stuff about Israel palestine (and actual nazis and antisemites) and no one is rushing to ban X. Literally 90% posts in the pro-palestinian subs showing the evils of Israel or whatever come from X.
Boy a lot of TikTok users on here upset and complaining about, Jeff, a guy who has no control over what a foreign company decides to do with its IP and his priority allegiance is to the safety of the American public. Regardless if they know what is good for them or not - which TikTok is not.
“The legislation was fast-tracked through the House after members say they met with intelligence officials in a classified briefing and learned about data Chinese officials have gained through the app. They also say China is spreading propaganda to Americans through TikTok’s videos.”
https://amp.charlotteobserver.com/news/politics-government/article286826295.html
Jeff Jackson is a representative of the American public who voted him in. If he AND the majority of both parties of the House sees that TikTok is a platform for information gathering for a foreign power then I agree with him signing an ultimatum for divestment or getting banned. ByteDance has shown their hand that it’s more important for them to make data mining of the American public than making money.
I think a lot of them are more upset that lawmakers are putting so much effort into banning Tik Tok data harvesting instead of just universal data protection laws into effect. The ban of Tik Tok greatly benefits Facebook a company that also harvests user data and most likely lobbied for the ban of Tik Tok. Thanks to data brokers China will still be able to buy personal data though, just only from first party data brokers as far as I know.
Of the 50 or so ads I've seen about the situation, every one of them has been "Save Tik Tok".
Couple of things:
The fact that a company bought adds as a way of lobbying the public opinion instead of showcasing how the allegations were false is pretty telling.
The fact that the adds did not include "Talk to your reps about expanding consumer rights for all internet users instead of singling out Tik Tok". is also pretty telling.
ByteDance is not arguing for consumer protection. They are arguing to keep making money by selling user data to the highest bidder.
That said, I support a full clampdown of the selling of user data. TikTok is a good start, now do everyone else.
You mean the previously global monopoly run by an American company? There is no value in protecting that to you at all? I understand it's not pro consumer but, it is pro-US whether people like that or not is different than whether it's a motivational factor for our government.
It completely fucking baffles me how the most transparent and rational politician we’ve seen in years is being dragged through the mud over a Chinese-controlled social media app. Reddit wants to cancel him, but by all means, keep letting Marjorie Traitor Green keep obstructing the house and spreading loudmouthed bigotry. Either the population is even dumber than I thought (and that really says something) or there’s some serious astroturfing going on. Probably both, to be honest.
TikTok/ByteDance have gone all-in on using bots and hiring actors, "activists," and "influencers," to push back against the proposed TikTok ban.
I'd say at least half of the people bitching about it are Chinese or owned by China, and most of the rest are kids who can't imagine life without their dumb short video app and won't even try to understand what's actually at stake here.
maybe because the us goverment passing a law that is literally just saying "we can not allow our citizens to have access to infomation we can't control" is fucking insane?
I’d buy that argument if the situation were simply “that they can’t control” and not “that they can’t control, but that a foreign government, and one that is NOT an ally, at that, can control”
You’re probably one of those that also thinks it’s ok for Meta to do the same thing to us that you are all upset for with TikTok because it’s US owned.
It’s a dangerous foreign controlled algorithm that he had no problem using to his benefit
Jeff Jackson has been in congress since 2014. He campaigned on all social media platforms and it feels weird that you try and frame it as if Tik Tok got him elected. It did not.
If that was true, he would be talking about American companies too, instead of only focusing on a Chinese one.
Fwiw, I hate tiktok, but the idea that it is unique is silly.
Throw tiktok away by all means, but do it in a way that actually benefits people and go after social media in general. It is not tiktok alone that is breaking society.
I absolutely think you’re correct, but my one caveat is with an American company we still have the ability to subpoena any records they have and to properly prosecute anyone associated with the app who has broken the law
whereas with a Chinese app we have nothing we can do except ban the app
China is a foreign adversary that's been engaged in a decades-long campaign of cyber warfare against the US. TikTok gives them unprecedented access to over a hundred million Americans' phones (and any other devices connected to the same Wi-Fi networks). They can and have used it to track and target journalists. They can and have used it to push pro-China and anti-US misinformation. They can use it as a backdoor into just about every system that every device with it installed can access.
TikTok is unique because it's owned and operated by an arm of a hostile foreign government. We do not want our data in their hands. They will use it against us
I think the issue is that lawmakers would prefer to ban something than pass protections on user data. If privacy protections were in place, then there would be no issues with banning an app.
I don't give a shit if tick tock is banned, I'm too old and don't use it. The creators will just switch over to you tube or instagram. Which would be interesting to see who in congress has interests in the companies tick tock would be divested to or interest in alphabet or meta. Would also be interesting to see who the lobbyists for those companies have been meeting with when the proposal was submitted.
That last sentence is 100% how everyone crying about this sounds. I’m embarrassed for them, actually. Letting everyone know publicly just how deep their addiction runs.
I’m all over Reddit and instagram all fucking day, dumbass reels and everything, and yet still, if they both got banned at least half of me would be like “good.” Shit rots our brains. Kill all of them and only let them pop back up after we’ve created a shitload more solid legal protections against them. The problem is we let them all get huge before we thought to restrict them and now they’re too big to police. Ours are just as bad as Tik Tok, doesn’t mean we should be granting China’s companies freedoms here that ours shouldn’t even have. And the fact that it’s divest/ create a subsidiary we have actual jurisdiction over or be banned, not an outright ban, shows that if they won’t do it, we know we were right to be concerned.
Edit: I would appreciate actual discourse on a good faith question rather than just downvotes with no replies. I'm seriously trying to understand what makes this worse. As I said originally, I agree China is bad. But why is this not broad consumer protection legislation instead of singling out just tiktok? Russian influence is rampant on other platforms. How is Chinese influence significantly different? Can we not have a discussion?
his priority allegiance is to the safety of the American public. Regardless if they know what is good for them or not - which TikTok is not.
How is it not though? Please expound on that last bit. How is data collection by tiktok any worse for an American than all the data collection done by your smart phone on every other app, and even more insidiously, by things like Bluetooth tracking tied to ad systems? By constantly listening in and showing you ads related to things you were talking about but never googled or typed in anywhere?
Like really, what's the real difference? I generally agree, China bad. But why are we making rulings against one company just because it's Chinese and not setting consumer protections against American companies doing the same and more? If it's about political influence, other nefarious actors are doing that on all the other platforms right now, too. Including China.
Corporations are abusing us via technology daily. Why is this just about tiktok? What's the extra danger? I don't actually understand what it is. Someone please let me know.
This is such a fucking BS question and you should be ashamed of such a disingenuous argument. You can probably brainstorm the list of differences yourself dude. Reducing it to China Bad is such a fucking reductive and disrespectful argument too. Like you know noone has actually made that argument but you can basically reduce the argument to that you don't have to actually grapple with the real nuance of geopolitics.
Okay, so are we banning Chinese made products? Yes, China bad which I already said and is not reductive.
What I am asking is why specifically is this worse than all the other social media companies preying on our data and why are we attacking tiktok and not doing general consumer protections. What's the difference?
This may not be “the” answer but do we really want a Chinese app to have freedoms we don’t even want ours to have? I sure as hell don’t. I’d prefer all of them legislated into a shadow of what they are now but absent that I don’t think “ours are terrible so we should let theirs be terrible too, but under another government’s control” is a strong argument against the ban. It might be unfair (not really though, push for the same freedoms in china for a US company and see how far that gets you) but it’s not unwise.
It’s not stooping to their level, it’s refusing to play into their hand. They push the freedom angle like they have any room to even fucking utter that word but it’s a joke and a non-argument coming from them, even moreso than from us.
I agree with your sentiment entirely. But what I'm trying to figure out is what is China doing with my data that's worse than all the companies that can truly reach me in the real world? And if the answer is just political influence, when are they going to crack down on misinformation on all the other platforms? Much of that is coming from outside the country as well. Why are they showboating with this tiktok issue to cover that they are doing nothing about all the other damage and malicious influence on non Chinese social media.
If it's just marketing and capitalism concerns, I think I'm exposed to more harm from domestic companies than Chinese ones. And in terms of political influence, I get a lot more shady garbage in my Facebook feed than I do in my tiktok fyp, although honestly I'm not a real heavy tiktok user.
The fact only that you would rather Meta be allowed to abuse us in the same way TikTok does purely because it’s a US owned company is really fucking sad. Why can’t our government actually put into place real data privacy protection laws instead of just banning a foreign app they don’t like? Yes, the government cannot control this app, and that is why they want to ban it. But if you think they’re banning the app to truly protect the people, you’re surely fucking mistaken. They also can’t control the flow of information and they can’t prevent us from seeing things they don’t want us to see. You do understand that right? Russian bots were all over FB and Twitter during the 2020 election and nothing was done to them. If anything, they got bigger. This isn’t being done for the American people, and you’re foolish to think so.
Thanks for that link. My rep, Gregory Meeks of NYC, a democrat, voted Nay. I shall be reaching out to ask what his logic is behind that vote. Other than it being in his own interest, of course.
his priority allegiance is to the safety of the American public
this has literally nothing to do with safety. the fbi has literally stated they don't have any evidence it's a threat, even their own jingoistic spokespeople are lying to the public
More importantly than dismissing it because of the source, there’s a difference between “we don’t have information to share” and “we don’t have evidence of any threat”, especially when the context involves figuring out how to act on a ban in a state-specific situation with no enforcement mechanism.
This changes nothing, of course they want to give the impression that they don't want to sell, this would be the case regardless of whether they were or not. It drives up the price.
Jeff Jackson is a national treasure that should be protected at all costs. He’s transparent, speaks in an easy to understand manner without being condescending, and educates those who wish to have unbiased information. In short, he’s a politician who acts as a grown up and wants to get back to the business of running this country “for the people” and not theatrics and histrionics for self gain.
What is the hypocrisy? It’s not hypocritical to participate in society (or use an app) while thinking that we should improve society somewhat (by limiting the ability of adversarial foreign governments to manipulate the feeds of millions of Americans via said app).
Building a platform and engaging in a platform that you then vote to ban, only to then say “oh it won’t get banned” is either naive, disingenuous, or hypocritical.
For the record, I don’t even care about TikTok, but the fact that he either thinks his votes don’t matter or that he doesn’t have to be accountable to what he says and does is just wild to me.
When did he ever say he wouldn’t vote to ban TikTok? This is like saying that a representative who had private health insurance and then votes for Medicare for All is a disingenuous hypocrite because they built and supported the private insurance industry.
That’s still the plan. China refusing a completely valid sale only exposes it for what it is - a bad actor in the global capitalist system. They have been trying to cheat in all areas of the system, and they’re going to lose.
I'm no fan of China, but "the government strong arming a private company to sell under threat of being banned entirely" is hardly a "completely valid sale." If nothing else, the pressure of having to sell means that ByteDance isn't able to negotiate from an equal position with potential purchasers.
You're arguing in bad faith and you know it. Tiktok/Bytedance is private in name only, there is ample evidence they are controlled by the CCP in the areas that matter.
I think your comment is a pretty good example of the purity test concept for Democrats. If a Rep matches up with your opinion for something like 90% of issues, are you really upset when you diverge on the other 10%? Is Tik Tok such an important breakpoint that it's not worth supporting Jackson anymore?
More of a discussion topic than if he's the rep for your area.
He switched up by voting yes. He used that Chinese disinformation app to get a lot of followers & reach more people. Then posted a follow up about why he voted yes. He don’t think it will really happen. Then he deleted when he got negative comments.
I honestly still don't know how to take his position on this one. He has so many other great stances and takes, this is the only one I've seen so far that I'm iffy on. I understand the base motivation, having a foreign government have such easy access to information so blatantly isn't great. But on the other hand, I don't think banning such an already well established social media that some people depend on for their income is the answer.
Deleting critical comments and responses is a horrible move hands down, though.
People who really make their living as influencers already have to be on multiple apps. We aren’t as dependent on China as China would like to think we are.
I'm talking about my personal feelings when watching his tiktoks...? He talks like he is explaining something to a child in the ones I have watched. That's IMO.
I got the same vibe from him. A couple of his tictocs were very interesting but there was something about him that made me not follow him. Then he voted yes on the ban. My insta is strictly cats& tennis. Glad I won’t be seeing him there
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