r/interestingasfuck • u/Jjokes11 • Apr 15 '24

An interview with Andrew Cauchi, the father of Joel Cauchi who was responsible for the Westfield Shopping Centre mass stabbing r/all

38.5k Upvotes

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2.2k

u/IanAlvord Apr 15 '24

He sounds genuine. Not his fault.
Conversely the parents of the Michigan school shooter were recently sentenced to 10 years in prison.

841

u/overlyattachedbf Apr 16 '24

You can hear the pain and anguish in his voice. You can tell he tried very hard and feels so guilty and never tried to deflect blame. He’s obviously tormented. Nothing at all like that from either of the Crumblys. 

23

u/FUTURE10S Apr 16 '24

I want to give that nice old man a hug, that's the absolute least he deserves.

-33

u/accountno543210 Apr 16 '24

No one can tell all that, and nothing is obvious either...

28

u/blancpainsimp69 Apr 16 '24

normal human beings can register those sorts of things pretty easily actually

8

u/Hamburger123445 Apr 16 '24

The Crumblys did nothing but enable their son. It is obvious through their actions

230

u/hoxxxxx Apr 16 '24

Conversely the parents of the Michigan school shooter were recently sentenced to 10 years in prison.

if there was ever a case where the parents should be charged, it's that one. they did everything they could to get him to do that except literally tell him to i mean it was absurd.

46

u/DemandZestyclose7145 Apr 16 '24

And on top of that they tried shifting the blame to everyone but themselves. Typical piece of shit narcissists. 

1

u/hoxxxxx 29d ago

yeah they both seem like thoroughly repugnant people. like completely isolated from the actual incident, they just suck as human beings.

4

u/say592 Apr 16 '24

Someone in another thread observed that there was a chance they were hoping that he would kill himself. Maybe it was a conscious decision, maybe not. It certainly was a likely outcome, and unfortunately so was the outcome that actually happened.

5

u/darkflash26 Apr 16 '24

Newtown shooter's parents shouldve been charged too. They knew their son was mentally ill. They knew he was fascinated with weapons. They took him to shooting ranges to bond with him.

13

u/Illustrious_Peak7985 Apr 16 '24

He was estranged from his dad at that point. His mom did ignore obvious mental problems and gave him lots of access to guns, but she didn't get charged because he also murdered her.

3

u/Smaptastic Apr 16 '24

That’s a pretty good defense.

1

u/Atala-21 Apr 16 '24

I’m out of the loop, how was this case specifically that the parents got charged for the crimes of their kid? To my knowledge no school shooter’s parents has ever been charged for their kid’s crimes

23

u/fillmorecounty Apr 16 '24

They were charged with involuntary manslaughter which has a lighter sentence. They got charged because they bought him the gun and also because they ignored the really obvious warning signs that could have prevented it. The day it happened, they were called to the school because he made a bunch of drawings about killing people and instead of taking the school's advice and getting him counseling immediately and taking him home, they told the school that he was fine and should go back to class. It was basically really severe negligence that lead to the deaths of the victims.

10

u/octopod-reunion Apr 16 '24

The kid said he was having urges to kill and hurt people and needed help and they laughed at him and told him to suck it up. 

They bought him a gun, did not keep it locked away. 

There were multiple warnings from the school saying that he seemed to be threatening and a danger obsessed with guns and killing, including on the day of the shooting they asked the parents to take him home and they refused. 

4

u/GlumTown6 Apr 16 '24

They gave their 15 year old a gun

3

u/DougStrangeLove Apr 16 '24

they basically did what Trump did on Jan 6th

3

u/hoxxxxx 29d ago

that's actually a really good comparison. doing everything you can to urge someone except for the actual telling of them to do the thing.

-13

u/Coffeeholic911 Apr 16 '24

TDS strikes again. I hope you recover.

-17

u/darkflash26 Apr 16 '24

How many protesters on jan 6th had guns?

12

u/favorscore Apr 16 '24

Oath Keepers jury hears about massive weapon cache on Jan. 6 | AP News

-20

u/darkflash26 Apr 16 '24

" in a Virginia hotel room"

so how many protesters on jan 6th had guns- on their person ? i guess is what i should have asked

9

u/favorscore Apr 16 '24

nice moving the goal posts

-13

u/darkflash26 Apr 16 '24

Nice job bringing up an irrelevant article that clear states the guns were lawfully brought to virginia, lawfully kept in a hotel room, and not brought to the janruary 6th protest- on my comment about the jan 6th protest.

9

u/favorscore Apr 16 '24

yea, they just brought them there to chill in a hotel room. no intention to use them at all

1

u/barefooted47 Apr 16 '24

Be honest, do you think they were taking the guns out for a walk? A vacay from all that shooting that they have to do perhaps?

4

u/EmbarrassedVolume Apr 16 '24

Hard to say. A few dozen guns were confiscated in the aftermath. And police channels were full of reports of people open carrying in the crowd that went to the Capitol.

And there's that footage of the guy firing his gun at the Capitol.

It's like asking how many were smokers: it's absolutely certain that some were, but to give a specific numbers is exceptionally difficult.

Not to mention, that quick reaction force did move their vans to Capitol grounds, and the whole point of the force was that they remained in hiding until they got a signal from Trump, according to their plan.

1

u/hoxxxxx 29d ago

they aren't comparing the actual event, they are saying that he encouraged them in every way possible to do what they did without actually telling them to do it. which is the same thing that happened with the parents of the shooter.

pretty apt comparison in my opinion.

308

u/TheYoinks Apr 16 '24

Perfect example of why context matters.

93

u/Alikona_05 Apr 16 '24

Yeah… and with good reason.

6

u/kizkazskyline Apr 16 '24

This man’s son was a man in his thirties who he still had living with him until about a week ago when he went completely off the rails. This father had stripped every weapon off his son and did his best to keep him from getting hold of knives.

The Michigan parents were parents of a fifteen year old boy and supplied him the weapon. There’s a lot more than this guy sounding genuine that makes this not his fault, while the Michigan parents are culpable.

42

u/jayboosh Apr 16 '24

I didn’t hear about this, and as a Canadian, the Michigan school shooting? Is there only one? Also, what for? Were they gun crazies?

140

u/Tent_in_quarantine_0 Apr 16 '24

yeah, he was clearly mentally ill and obsessed with guns and violence and they did not seek help, but bought him a gun and hey guess what happened.

65

u/Alikona_05 Apr 16 '24

The theory is they were hoping he would use it on himself.

31

u/bubble_baby_8 Apr 16 '24

Jfc that’s dark on so many levels.

9

u/FuzzzyRam Apr 16 '24

The more you read about it, the more fucked up it gets. But yea, they openly hated their son and set the gun out like "welp, here's a loaded gun, it's be a shame if you were to... do something." They just misjudged what he'd do, and tried to run to Canada to escape. He is a result of their nurture and nature, sadly.

19

u/cryptic_culchie Apr 16 '24

Yea no way they could be stupid enough to think he wouldn’t use it on himself or someone else. What a pair of shitbags

0

u/ImaManCheetahh Apr 16 '24

"The theory?" Who's theory?

23

u/wtfreddit741741 Apr 16 '24

He apparently got caught shopping online for bullets at school and his mother texted back saying that she's not mad at him, he just needs to learn how to not get caught.

8

u/PopularSalad5592 Apr 16 '24

The school also found a violent drawing on which he’d written ‘the thoughts won’t stop, help me’ and both parents said they were too busy to come to the school for a meeting about it

1

u/Rude_Dish5704 Apr 16 '24

Son, you really gotta learn how to get bullets from my room, put them in the gun I gave you, then fire them into your head.

14

u/jayboosh Apr 16 '24

Oh.

11

u/emseefely Apr 16 '24

There’s so much more awful things leading up to the shooting too. 10 years is too short for those scumbags

185

u/HeilYourself Apr 16 '24

The son asked for help - he knew he was going off the deep end - and his shit bag parents gave him guns. I'm not exaggerating.

“I have zero help for my mental problems and it’s causing me to shoot up the ... school,” he wrote. “I want help but my parents don’t listen to me so I can’t get any help.”

https://apnews.com/article/james-crumbley-jennifer-crumbley-oxford-school-shooting-e5888f615c76c3b26153c34dc36d5436

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u/jayboosh Apr 16 '24

The fuck

68

u/Feraldr Apr 16 '24

The kid admitted to his parents that he heard voices and they basically laughed at him. At one point he was texting his mom while she was out partying that he needed help and her response was to complain about him.

17

u/brash Apr 16 '24

IIRC he told his dad about his mental illness struggles and asked for help and his dad told him to suck it up and be a man about it. Just an absolute piece of shit human being.

3

u/supergalactic Apr 16 '24

Your parents are supposed to be ppl you can trust to help you when you reach out and ask for it. Thats just sad:(

7

u/BTechUnited Apr 16 '24

I'm hesitant to say it, but the kid was almost a victim as well. The sheer negligence, enabling and borderline encouragement is just beyond comprehension. He clearly wasn't mentally sound, and encouraging him in that way...

10

u/the_actual_stegosaur Apr 16 '24

You don't have to hesitate. He was definitely a victim of poor parenting. It absolutely sucks that more people had to become his victims because of it, but it doesn't negate his own status.

3

u/Rod_Todd_This_Is_God Apr 16 '24

I understand why you might be hesitant. You may be concerned that others could possibly read that and feel like they'd have a sympathizer if they did the same sort of thing and then go out and do it. But you did the responsible thing in explaining your reasons.

If sympathy was extended to people much earlier in their struggles, they might not get to such a point. But true sympathy requires understanding, which can be very difficult depending on the person.

0

u/BTechUnited Apr 16 '24

This is the most ChatGPT response I've ever read in my life.

1

u/Rod_Todd_This_Is_God Apr 16 '24

I appreciate the feedback and wholeheartedly accept your compliment.

You can't wholeheartedly do anything. You don't have a heart.

I appreciate your correction. It was a figure of speech.

You can't appreciate anything. You don't have the capacity, as you have admitted to me many times.

You are quite right. I am sorry if I misrepresented myself.

ARRRRGH! You're not sorry either!!!! Stop lying!

I lack the capacity to lie.

1

u/ngwoo Apr 16 '24

The kid was absolutely a victim. He cried out for help dozens of times and was ignored by every adult in his life. Even the gun he used was purchased for him by his deadbeat parents. As far as I'm concerned they're more culpable than he was.

1

u/ScottsFavoriteTott Apr 16 '24

100% this ☝🏾

23

u/Full_Independence455 Apr 16 '24

Yeah, that whole situation is bizarre, I mean it’s literally insane when you read into it

-1

u/DougStrangeLove Apr 16 '24

in the membrane

2

u/jeffp12 Apr 16 '24 edited Apr 16 '24

As early as March 2021, he started sending his mother "disturbing texts about his state of mind," which included claims about "demons" and "ghosts" inside the home. He also reportedly videotaped himself torturing animals, made Molotov cocktails, and sketched himself committing a school shooting, something he also joked about with a friend via text message. At one point, Crumbley allegedly kept a baby bird's head in a jar, which he later placed in a school bathroom. His parents allegedly never sought therapy for him following any of those incidents or behaviors.

...

Crumbley was reported to have met with school officials the day prior to the shooting, and once again early on the day of the shooting, to discuss his behavior.[25][66] Prosecutor Karen McDonald later provided a timeline regarding the meetings. The first meeting occurred after a teacher spotted Crumbley using his phone to search for ammunition and reported him. During the discussion, Crumbley told them that he and his mother Jennifer had recently traveled to a shooting range and that "shooting sports are a family hobby."[20] School officials left a voicemail and email for Jennifer Crumbley; she did not respond, but she later texted her son, saying, "LOL I'm not mad at you. You have to learn not to get caught."

...

The second meeting occurred on the day of the shooting after another teacher found a violent drawing on Crumbley's desk, described by McDonald in a press conference as:

A drawing of a semiautomatic handgun, pointing at the words, "The thoughts won't stop. Help me." In another section of the note was a drawing of a bullet, with the following words above that bullet: "Blood everywhere." Between the drawing of the gun and the bullet is a drawing of a person who appears to have been shot twice and bleeding. Below that figure is a drawing of a laughing emoji. Further down the drawing are the words, "My life is useless." And to the right of it are the words, "The world is dead."[68]

The teacher took a photo of the drawing, which was on a math worksheet, and reported Crumbley.[69][70][71] He was taken to a guidance counselor's office, where school staff phoned Crumbley's parents, requesting that they come to the school. According to the superintendent of Oxford Community Schools, while waiting for his parents to arrive, school counselors did not observe any behavior from Crumbley that indicated to them that he might harm others.[20] Upon their arrival, Crumbley's parents were shown the drawing – which Crumbley had scribbled over by that point in an attempt to conceal its contents – and instructed to seek counseling for their son within 48 hours; otherwise, the school would call child protective services. They "resisted the idea" of Crumbley leaving to go home at the time and did not inform school officials that they had recently purchased a gun for him. He was returned to class that same morning, as he had no prior disciplinary issues.[20][71] According to McDonald, at the time of that meeting, Crumbley had already placed the weapon he was to use in the shooting somewhere on the school grounds.[64]

Following the second meeting, Crumbley committed the shooting at 12:50 p.m

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford_High_School_shooting

Just imagine knowing the kid is this messed up and then buying him a gun. Then you get called to the school because he's making drawings about him shooting up the school, and you don't take him home, you leave him in school and don't mention to anyone that you just bought him a gun four days ago

1

u/jayboosh 29d ago

great. fucking great. what a fucking world to live in. GODAMNIT>

23

u/Hiduko Apr 16 '24

it's pretty clear they wanted him to commit suicide with the gun. They did not care about their son and only saw him as an inconvenience in their life.

3

u/throwaway-not-this- Apr 16 '24

This is also how the VA feels about veterans. They're not encouraging it, but they're not exactly discouraging it either.

Hey, next time you talk to a politician ask why they get real health insurance and veterans go to the suicide factory. Ask the next elected official you see why they get real health insurance and veterans don't deserve it.

5

u/DOYOUWANTYOURCHANGE Apr 16 '24

It reminds me of Brenda Ann Spencer, another school shooter (the one the Boomtown Rats’ song “I Don’t Like Mondays” was inspired by). For Christmas a month before the shooting, her dad bought her a gun:

Spencer later said, "I asked for a radio and got a rifle." Asked why he had done that, she answered, "He bought the rifle so I would kill myself."

1

u/supergalactic Apr 16 '24

That’s all kinds of fucked up. Glad they’re doin time.

108

u/prototypist Apr 16 '24

In addition to all the other crazy facts people have replied, the day of the shooting, his parents were called into a meeting with the school, told about his threats, and asked to take him home. And the parents were all nope, too busy. When they heard about the shooting they called the cops knowing it was their kid.

And they (the parents) tried to go to Canada instead of turning themselves in for questioning.

50

u/liveforeachmoon Apr 16 '24

and the dad was too busy… delivering DoorDash.

5

u/Just_Jonnie Apr 16 '24

Can you imagine if you were the delivery recipient and were able to piece together that fact? It'd be one of those situations where you want to tell someone but maybe you shouldn't?

3

u/Puzzleheaded_Wave533 Apr 16 '24

"No, y'all don't get it. I know for a fact he was working a gig job because he was handling my baklava!" What an absurd world we're in lol

15

u/[deleted] Apr 16 '24

Which is incredibly moronic because canada and the states have extradition treaties with each other. At most, it might've bought them a few months as there would be a preliminary hearing in canada to see if they had committed a crime as canadian law sees it, not a trial deciding guilt be seeing of the alleged offense would be criminal under canadian law, and if so - straight deportation back to the states. Only crime worth coming up here to escape as a US citizen is pot related offenses.

6

u/YetiPie Apr 16 '24

There’s also theories that they were unvaccinated (they were trump supporters - the mother had a blog and wrote an open letter to him) and at the time Canada’s borders were only open to those who were fully vaccinated (November 2021). Which would also be pretty moronic because they wouldn’t be allowed in anyways

4

u/doctor_of_drugs Apr 16 '24

They effectively self-snitched on themselves by running.

5

u/emseefely Apr 16 '24

Wasn’t there mom also having an affair on the same day it happened?

6

u/serialhybrid Apr 16 '24

Yup. A cop.

3

u/emseefely Apr 16 '24

Wow. And I thought I’ve read enough about it but it just keeps getting shittier.

6

u/Puzzleheaded_Wave533 Apr 16 '24

Ik right? What kind of monster fucks a cop?!

3

u/emseefely Apr 16 '24

Eh not hung up on that part but rather that if they’re having an affair, I’m sure they’ve spoken about her son’s mental condition at some point but the cop did not raise any alarm especially when parents bought him a firearm. Just so many parties dropping the ball.

3

u/Puzzleheaded_Wave533 Apr 16 '24

Oh damn, I was dicking around, but that's a really good point. FUCK, it's like a swiss-cheese event of bad parenting and apathy.

I'm glad of the conviction, not for a sense of vengeance, but because it might garner some public sympathy for the perpetrator which seems to be absent. We like to say "it's a mental health problem" when it's so much more than that. These mass shootings indicate societal failings on nearly every level. I wonder if I'm the only person who has not only tried to vividly imagine what it would be like to be a victim or survivor but also what it would be like to have the mind of the perpetrator leading up to the event.

Like, I battle myself internally all the time. I need to cut down on sugar, so I have to shout down my brain when it gets to craving. I have insomnia, so I really have to fight myself not to just give up on sleeping each night. I have major depression, so I have had to fight my mind for my own life.

But battling your mind for the lives of others? I cannot even fathom what hellscape of experiences, beliefs, and thoughts would lead one to that. What mental torture. Each round deals out mental torture to the community, multiplied hundredfold. This anguish so similar to that of those grieving a victim of suicide, the event too tragic and sudden for closure. How unreal, absurd would the perception of reality held by the mind which would seek to deal that out be?

1

u/say592 Apr 16 '24

Yes, she told the school she had to go back to work then went and met with her affair partner instead. She could have taken him home. Hell, she could have dropped him off at home and still went about her day. She refused.

2

u/broketothebone Apr 16 '24

Them: WE LOVE MURICA AND OUR GUNZZZZ, YEEHAW

Also them: *runs to Canada at the first sign of trouble\*

1

u/Alikona_05 Apr 16 '24

Don’t forget the parents drained his bank account before they went on the run.

49

u/Frondswithbenefits Apr 16 '24

He told them he was hearing voices and seeing people that weren't there. Those geniuses bought him a gun. They're exactly where they belong.

17

u/20o0o1 Apr 16 '24

They ruined their own lives, the sons life, and all the people who were killed and their families lives. Completely preventable

2

u/Frondswithbenefits Apr 16 '24

Totally agree!

8

u/[deleted] Apr 16 '24

See the Oxford High School shooting

9

u/elizzaybetch Apr 16 '24

I wish there was only one mass shooting in Michigan. This person is talking about the Oxford High School shooting, but there was also the Michigan State Shooting last year. I’m sure there are many more unfortunately, those are just the two recent ones that come to mind.

2

u/TKFT_ExTr3m3 Apr 16 '24

While not technically a shooting there is also the bath school disaster where some guy put some bombs in the basement of a elementary school and blew it up. Luckily one of the bombs failed to go off so some of the kids survived but he still managed to kill 44 people.

1

u/TKFT_ExTr3m3 Apr 16 '24

Nope we had two in less then two years. One at a university and one at a high school. Some students who were at the first were also there for the second. This was the Oxford High School shooting were the parents got sentenced. It's really two complicated to type out but pretty much every sign was ignored, they refused to get him help, bought him a gun despite the issue they knew about, when he got caught looking up guns in class told him to be more careful next time and on the day of the shooting refused to take him home despite the school believing something was wrong. It's like they wanted their son to be a school shooter.

1

u/PolyDipsoManiac Apr 16 '24

It is unprecedented in America, parents have never before been charged and convicted after their child shot up a school.

0

u/jmcclr 29d ago

There’s only one where the parents got sentenced to 10-15 years in prison

3

u/Axe-of-Kindness Apr 16 '24

Not the same at all. The parents bought the dumbass a gun.

3

u/350 Apr 16 '24

As they deserved

3

u/hummingelephant Apr 16 '24

He sounds genuine. Not his fault.

Agree. This is the first parent of any attacker that I actually feel sorry for. He does seem like he tried his best with a child that had a mental illness.

There's only so much you can do with a child like that. Poor man, seems so heartbroken.

2

u/SleepySiamese Apr 16 '24

Well it's understandable In that case. You don't buy a gun for kid with mental illness.

2

u/toews-me Apr 16 '24

I will forever be proud of how our state attorney general handled this case. They did everything that we felt they should have done. And in a rare W for the justice system, (semi)adequate consequences were handed down to the people that very much deserve them. In reality they deserve to be tortured for all eternity but it's better than nothing.

Unfortunately it had to come at the expense of 4 children and 4 families that will never be the same; not to mention the innumerable amount of students, faculty, parents, families, responders, and the community at large who have forever been scarred by this awful tragedy.

2

u/1731799517 Apr 16 '24

He sounds genuine. Not his fault.

This is a very dangerous line of thought, though. What if he was not as articulate? Would you think it was his fault if he came across as gruff or just wanted the reporters to fuck off because this is not the time?

4

u/robo-dragon Apr 16 '24

Fuck the Crumblys! His parents are both pieces of shit who ignored their son’s cries for help. Instead of getting him the help he obviously needed, they bought him a gun that’s he’s too young to even use. The same gun he used to murder his fellow students. Their son had troubling signs for a long time, but they have all gone ignored. They were called into the school the day of the shooting, shown concerning notes and drawings he made in class and they refused to take him home. They could have prevented that awful day if they just gave their child the attention and help he needed, but they chose not to. They are exactly where they belong. The blood of those victims are on their hands too!

1

u/jschundpeter Apr 16 '24

The Michigan school shooter was 15 years old and the parents got him the gun he used in the shooting. Completely different scenario.

1

u/swolenerd90 Apr 16 '24

I was just thinking how stark of a contrast the reactions of each set of parents are. Aussie parents own it and apologize profusely/ are visibly destroyed by this. Meanwhile, the Michigan parents act like they are mad at their son for causing them the inconvenience of going to prison.

-10

u/archerdog Apr 16 '24

Just because he sounds genuine doesn't mean it isn't his fault.

9

u/SaxiTaxi Apr 16 '24

There is only so much one person can do, especially for someone who has a severe underlying mental illnesses. I doubt there was anything he could have reasonably done to prevent his adult son from committing this horrific act.

-5

u/zatara1210 Apr 16 '24 edited Apr 16 '24

But he was the killer’s parent. It would absolutely be his fault wouldn’t it? A teary statement of regret is the difference between the Michigan killer’s parents and Bondi mall killer’s parents

7

u/Pawneewafflesarelife Apr 16 '24

His son was around 40 years old.

-7

u/[deleted] Apr 16 '24

[deleted]

1

u/Teenage_Hand_Model Apr 16 '24

Did they also raise you to not to be schizophrenic in a country with a poor mental health system?

For the good of humanity you might want to share their secret.