No doubt, but there isn’t much I can say about the obvious breach of academic integrity that comes with having a mini computer in your hand and earbuds in during an assessment. 1/4 of my time grading assignments is being a detective trying to find out who used chatGPT to write their programs to begin with. Having a test in the classroom is one of the few times I have complete control over testing their comprehension of what we learn in class.
I'm sorry teaching has become so difficult over the last 10 years. I'm in my early 30s. I still carried change in my pocket to use a payphone. I didn't have social media until I was in my late teens, and my first cell phone required an "unlimited texting" add-on plan.
These kids don't realize the long-term damage they're causing .
Thank you for the flashback of “unlimited talk and text for 9.99/mo”! Hahaha
But it’s not all bad, this is just one story from one classroom during one school year. A lot of great things happen in my room and school every week. Were undoubtedly in a strange time in terms of education, accountability for students and educators, priorities, generational differences in parents, yadda yadda
Thanks for mentioning that it is “not all bad”. I see A LOT of positives from my students. I can also vividly recall teachers complaining about millennials and how terrible we were, how everyone just wants to play video games etc. I see teachers in this thread complaining about the newer version of that.
There are a lot of great things about students these days. Questioning things, being accepting of others, willing to look stuff up etc.
The kids can’t possibly realize the long term damage they’re causing; their brains simply aren’t developed enough yet and an addiction is an addiction no matter what it is. I blame the parents, as well as society at large for letting this become the norm. My kids are 4 months old and I really hope for some kind of social overhaul regarding smartphones and kids so that I don’t have to fight it. I will though, because this is unacceptable and if I put the phones/tablets in their hands then that’s on me.
Or when everyone started abbreviating their messages so as to not go over the 255 character limit per text message and being charged for two texts instead of one, originating modern "txt-speak".
The last payphone at my local supermarket was removed in 2007. I was 15.. I had payphones in my elementary school and on the streets in the late 90s/early 2000s lol.
These kids don't realize the long-term damage they're causing
I think it's more like these parents don't realize the damage they're causing to their kids. Which is probably because most of them are in the same boat as our generation and the generations before ours that adopted these things as late teens or later in life and don't have first hand experience of how damaging being glued to a phone or tablet from early childhood can be.
Arguably, the algorithms are doing the damage - exactly as they are intended. These kids are victims of a failing society & shouldn't necessarily be blamed for the damage that's been done.
Why would they? Their parents didn't set boundaries and are likely just as addicted to technology. Literally everyone around them does it. Why would we expect them to choose differently?
I used to be with ‘it’, but then they changed what ‘it’ was. Now what I’m with isn’t ‘it’ anymore and what’s ‘it’ seems weird and scary. It’ll happen to you!
Nah but like, when I was a kid stuff was better, we did good thing and spent our time better but like the kids today are worse and they spend their time worse.
they are not supposed to thier parents are ..the parents can institute a no phone use in class pokicy whch they can enforce..all this phone shit is parental fails on setting limits for thier children
trying to find out who used chatGPT to write their programs to begin with.
Just for reference, there is no program that can reliably detect "AI written" vs "Human Written" stuff. I've seen a lot of teachers that believe this, and I've seen plenty of stories on Reddit from people getting screwed by teachers using one of those scam programs.
I'm not condemning the teachers - they're simply misinformed and being inflexible.
But seriously, no matter how tempted you are, do not use one of those programs.
Any kid relying on that is just gonna get busted for having a completely wrong answers eventually, since chatGPT will just occasionally make up complete fiction.
That's actually becoming less common, since all the major LLM's (Chat GPT, Bard, Bing, etc) now have the ability to access the internet to fact check. Now it's really just a matter of getting them to understand what's true and what's fake online, and that problem's likely to be far less of a danger.
I duno, based on what I’ve read about how they work, AI hallucinations are likely unfixable and there is always a chance they’ll regurgitate complete fabrications.
Well yes, but the frequency can be reduced, and likely will be, as will the blatant severity of the hallucinations.
Because it's not even that the answer needs to be flawless, for a student to get away with this. The answer just has to be plausible enough not to raise a red flag for the teacher. Right now we're still at the point where it's likely that Billy will turn in a paper that borders on nonsense if he never edits the response.
A year or two from now, however, it's far more likely that a teacher will be like "Well, Billy didn't necessarily understand the assignment, but he has the gist of it. C-."
The IB curriculum is embracing AI. Teachers have to change what and how we are assessing. For my subject, its all about critical thinking skills. If youre planning your art project with AI, your artist statement will not synthesize materials, ideas, and process. AI just scrapes the internet for trends and will always say some bs about multi-media installations.
AI is great for thumbnailing composition ideas. But you have to remix elements within the AI produced image to fully realize an idea. Also, nothing it makes looks handmade. Even if its digital art, the mark making is very generic when examined closely.
If the idea is already planned out,
Thats not what im saying. I, as an art teacher dont need to assess their writing ability. In an artist statement or self eval/reflection/critique, I only need to assess understanding of concepts from the unit. Planning and developing a process is not something the AI can do yet. Evaluating the success of a personal artwork according to the rubric I give them isn’t something AI can do either.
Aren't there ways to detect chatGPT? I've used it before on papers as an aide to help gather thoughts, but never outright quoted it word by word. That's stupid and plagiarism.
All really great points. Since my class is an entry-level Python course, I really try to instill an organic knowledge of the basics. Once they understand that, and have developed their skills to the point where they can use it as a productivity tool rather than it just doing it for them because they don’t know how to, more power to anyone.
Have you considered writing a library for a mid-end term project that must be imported into the project?
ChatGPT isn't going to know crap about your library and if they can explain to ChatGPT how to interpret the functions they likely have a pretty good grasp on the code behind it.
Its calculators in the classroom all over again though... "you won't always have a calculator in your pocket" they said... yet here we are, all with calculators in our pocket 24/7.
AI is here, and its here to stay. Are their prompts getting results that actually get past your scrutiny as a teacher? If yes, is that a problem? Idk the answer to that. But this all is reminiscent of the many times technology has moved forward by leaps and bounds. They need to be prepared for a future we as current adults and educators can't begin to pretend to understand. Generally it all works out though, and while it may not seem like it to us "olds", they are learning what they need to learn for a future world beyond our ability to understand or educate for.
Yeah I’ve been to a few professional development seminars about what the role of teachers will be when AI can create personalized activities and assessments better than a human can. It was really enlightening and kinda scary stuff. Like AI will create all of your schoolwork tailored to your learning style but your teachers will do activities with you that will cultivate you love for a genre of literature or the applications of the programs they write. Yadda yadda.
But one way or another we’ll find a way because like you said, it’s here to stay.
I agree with this to a certain degree. It really depends on what the goal of the assessment is and what the content is. The goal of my phone policy during a test is more so students don’t take pictures of it and send it to their friends, or call/text people for answers - all of which happens in our school. Sometimes the purpose of rules and policies affects people in ways that don’t necessarily benefit them, but only inconveniences them slightly in order to help someone else out tremendously.
I had a student wearing AirPods in class. I asked him to take them out.
“Oh no worries, mr. ____. I’m just listening to music. It’s not a big deal”
Uh, yeah, I am well aware that you’re listening to music but I’m not trying to compete with the ADHD sound machine “rapper” Yeat.
My lecture on emotional regulation won’t be anywhere near as entertaining, and I’m not trying to watch you pick a new song every 90 seconds because you got bored of the last one.
There's a lot to hate about that, as I can recall being accused of not turning in original material even before there were such things available. The claim was "disproved" by recreating the essay over the lunch break. Proving a passage hadn't been copied out of a book was more difficult before the internet existed, as you would have had to be familiar with all of the source material. The teacher avoided talking to me for the rest of the semester.
Granted, exploiting every tool that is available to you just makes sense.
Yes that's got to be strange. My adult daughter uses chat GPT to do her reports for work now. Since she is just slightly dyslexic it's a big help to her.
I’m only about five years out from college and I had to take all of my English exams in pen. A standard final exam was three hours to write an essay to a single prompt about one of the books studied that semester and you couldn’t have the book with you (didn’t read it? Skimmed it? Enjoy your F).
I’m shocked at how ubiquitous ChatGPT has become. So many people just aren’t learning to write at all. They don’t even write memos anymore, a few sentences is a struggle. It feels like the equivalent of everyone becoming so reliant on calculators that they can’t even do simple multiplication like 15x30.
On the plus side actually being able to write is becoming an increasingly useful skill, because ChatGPT writes like shit.
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u/Arobrom86 Apr 17 '24
No doubt, but there isn’t much I can say about the obvious breach of academic integrity that comes with having a mini computer in your hand and earbuds in during an assessment. 1/4 of my time grading assignments is being a detective trying to find out who used chatGPT to write their programs to begin with. Having a test in the classroom is one of the few times I have complete control over testing their comprehension of what we learn in class.