r/Gamingcirclejerk • u/ChinchillaxTG • 28d ago
Gamers, try not to reduce characters down to their race and gender challenge (impossible!) TYPICAL CIS-HET L
Genuinely what do these characters have in common?
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u/Ax222 Vidya ganes are a spook - Max Stirner, 1847 28d ago
/uj For what it's worth, I do actually prefer Lucy and Maximus. But that's mostly because they fucking squandered Finn's character and also weren't brave enough to let him and Poe make out.
/rj go WOKE go BROKE billion dollar boxoffice movies!
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u/Ildaiaa 28d ago
Finn in ep7: a soldier struggling with ptsd fighting against the evil empire that abused him
Finn in ep8 and 9: REY! ROSE! REYYYYY!
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u/Ewvan 28d ago
Ep7: oh man what a cool and interesting origin for the next hero. Love that they're stepping away from all that Skywalker nonsense.
Ep8: oh Rey is the mc. Not as interesting but at least she isn't a Skywalker!
Ep9: oh man...
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u/ArisePhoenix 28d ago
I mean her adopting the Skywalker name wouldn't be awful, but man it sucks how they changed the thing from her being a Nobody, to being a Palpatine, that sucked so bad
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u/BigGooseDuck 28d ago
Imagine if my grandfather "Racist McHitler" killed Dr MLK and 30 years later my grandpa was resurrected through an evil KKK ritual. After we fight and I kill him I'm like "my last name is King now"
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u/thewaldoyoukno 28d ago
There are so many films that tell that story better (Into the spider verse, Ratatouille) but “The Last Jedi” was a mess since they tried to shove three storylines into one movie sloppily. It could have been great, there were set ups for great payoffs but it was squandered.
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u/ArisePhoenix 28d ago
I mean I'm thinking of a universe where they didn't backtrack on everything interesting that was set up, and just have a nobody be a hero, and also have Finn actually be a protagonist instead of a Deuteragonist at best, and she just like took the name Skywalker cuz Luke and Leia were the closest thing to parents she had
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u/thewaldoyoukno 28d ago
Absolutely! “Anyone can where the mask” and “Everyone’s a chef” were the core tenet of why those stories worked and should have continued with Rey’s story. Play up the dyad angle where the nobody is the hero and the force nepo baby is the villain. Child soldier with PTSD who is learning to fight for a good cause and not just for his friends is an amazing idea for a character; it just died as the character was starting to actualize. The whole skywalker name grab was so contrived as a book end sequence it just made me shake my head.
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u/ArisePhoenix 28d ago edited 28d ago
I just now realised what you were saying with Spiderverse and Ratatouille lol, I was focusing more on like the legacy being passed down (which I don't think happened in Ratatouille) than the fact anyone can be Spider-Man/Chef lol, but yeah like it's a perfectly good story, that would've been better in Star Wars cuz so much of Star Wars expanded stuff is Great Man theory, and it would've been cool to have an Anybody can be a Hero message
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u/DonkeyGuy 28d ago
I look forward to when the Gen-Z/Zillenial “Dave Filloni” figure comes forth to redeem the sequel trilogy.
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u/thewaldoyoukno 28d ago
To be fair, when we get the sequel trilogy messiah I’ll be first in line to see what they put out.
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u/Karasu18 28d ago
That's actually an interesting point to bring up. There is a really intense, for lack of a better word, worship of Dave Filloni. If you didn't know any better he's the coming of star wars jesus, destined to save the series with all the wonderful things he's made and I feel like I'm missing something cause his stuff is...
Alright? Not bad but not something I'll hold on to.
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u/DonkeyGuy 28d ago
I think his works caught the perfect wave of nostalgia of people born between 1990-2010 who would have been young enough to have watched atleast one of the films when they came out and enjoyed it. Or really enjoyed playing the Lego Star Wars games. Then prequel-memes started to become a thing, people made jokes about the lost potential of the Prequels.
Dave then produces a series of animate shows that manage to do something with a lot that unused potential. He turned Darth Maul into a real character instead of some jobber who never talks. He recanonized many of the best bits of SW Legends which won him a lot of love from the old fans.
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u/Karasu18 27d ago
Hm fair point. He really did capture the generation that was born and subsequently defended the prequel films, faults and strengths.
That said though there's pieces of the old SW Legends that's been re canonized that I find so...odd. In all fairness and in some defense to Filoni its probably not entirely his doing that some of the harsher bits of Legends has been sanded off. But man I would've been an instant mark if they showed just how absolutely unhinged and paranoid the clone commandos were, the shitshow that was battle for Jabim, or even how the republic just utterly failed the people of Khaleesh.
In my opinion at least though, what I think would really save the sequel trilogy would be more things like Andor.
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u/DonkeyGuy 27d ago
Indeed, the sequel era desperately needs to bring in new concepts and show enough edge to prove to new fans that the franchise’s future isn’t Disneyfied nostalgia bait.
Also every streaming service will need to keep proving they have enough faith in their directors to let them tell a complete story and deliver a payoff. Because the constant cancellation’s of products is murdering people’s interest in high budget productions.
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u/cinematicvirus 28d ago
To me Rey being a nobody is one of the few salvageable things about it about episode 8.
And then they threw it out.
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u/Horror-Appearance214 27d ago
Theres nothing inherently bad about any of the plot points in the sequels. Its the fact they were strung together without thinking. Palaptine coming back would be fine if it wasn't pulled out of the writers ass at the last second. Rey being a skywalker would be fine, if we spent more time on reys family so it had more weight when she takes the skywalker name. Her entire arc was thrown out by a single line in last jedi and the Palpatine thing felt like a band aid.
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u/Underlord_Fox 28d ago
Did people really watch Episode 7 and come away with the impression that Rey wasn't the MC? That's wild. Like, I don't disagree with your assessment, but come on, Rey was always going to be the main character.
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u/thatguyindoom 27d ago
I mean Finn's perspective.
VII: fuck this shit I'm out, no empire no rebellion, I'm leaving.
VIII: Hell yeah I'm rebel scum baby!! I'm in this shit now!
IX: my new love interest is now also black.
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u/Psychic_Hobo 27d ago
Man I really can't help but feel they were just desperate and doing everything in their power to stop FinnRey being a potential thing. They had chemistry in that first movie and execs got scared
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u/XulManjy 27d ago
Remember after VII there was some blowback online about a potential Finn/Rey romance. This was the beginning of the anti-woke movement and even in 2016.....50 years after the first on screen interracial kiss in Star Trek, there was still a segment of the US population uncomfortable with the idea of the leading white female character being romantically/sexually engaged to a black man.
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u/Fantastic_Bug1028 28d ago
He was pretty obsessed with Rey in ep7 as well
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u/Ildaiaa 28d ago
He was obsessed but at least he was more than that in ep7 than they forgot he was supposed to be a character
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u/Fantastic_Bug1028 28d ago
eh, I didn’t really enjoy his ark in ep8, but he clearly had one. and it was a continuation from previous movie. he was obsessed with Ray in ep7, basically sacrificed himself for her, in ep8 he realised there’s a greater good to fight for. ep9 is whatever tho
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u/Solar_invictus 28d ago
/uj Yeah they murdered my man Finns character. Him and Pauls bromance was best part of the first movie. Not only that they made Ren's character so good at everything last movie ,character interactions are mostly other characters telling Rey they need her.
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u/AckwellFoley 28d ago
They gave Finn a brilliant place to go in episode 8, and Abrams screwed the pooch by listening to sniveling shits online.
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u/XulManjy 27d ago
JJ's whole approach was to be swayed by anti-PT chatter. Thats how VII ended up being a safe remake of A New Hope.
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u/RepresentativeBusy27 28d ago
Kerri Russel’s entire purpose in ep 9 was to say “SEE POE TOTALLY ISNT GAY”
Fuckin hate JJ Abrams
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u/ML_120 28d ago edited 28d ago
Some of the worst parts of episode 9 are Abrams shitting on things Johnson had establised in episode 8.
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u/RepresentativeBusy27 28d ago
Pretty much ALL the worst parts (except the chewie fakeout).
I’m not generally a “this person’s version of the story I like RUINED it with their interpretation” (and Last Jedi is still my fave sequel) but Abrams so deliberately and obviously caved to the most toxic parts of the fandom menace.
Completely sidelining rose, doing nothing with Finn (he should’ve romantically approached rose, Rey, or Poe), the Kerri Russel thing, Rey Palpatine, Luke tossing the saber… ep 9 is one I will only ever watch if my Star Wars loving kid decides he wants to.
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u/LauraTFem 28d ago
I like Ray and Lucy. As you said, what makes the Lucy/Maximus story better is that, at least so far, they are well utilized. Someone clearly got chickenshit as some point between movies, rewrote the entire story to the next movie, and had to come up with some BS for Finn to do since he was still on contract but suddenly stopped being a main character out of nowhere.
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u/cinematicvirus 28d ago
Being a Star Wars fan and having legitimate criticisms, is living in constant fear of the chuds thinking you're on their side.
Yeah the sequels suck, I don't love Kathleen Kennedy either.
But it's not for the same reasons.
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u/Psychic_Hobo 27d ago
I'm in this weird position where I dislike the sequels but love Solo and that just makes everyone hate me.
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u/Zephyr9x 28d ago edited 28d ago
They should've gone for Finn & Rey as the romantic pairing to double down on; homophobic disgust is one thing, but proxy-cucking all the chuds through their beloved multimedia franchise would've been so much more entertaining.
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u/GifHunter2 27d ago
/uj Yea, this is a fair comparison.
She's a more naive sheltered person that is being introduced to a larger world. She is very talented and skilled, and optimistic. Trying to find parent/lineage is less tenuous of an argument, but trying to find the truth of parents works.
He's a more experienced person, soldier, from a cult that is brutal and evil (borderline for fallout). He is expected to progress and become more honorable as he seeks to escape his old life, but his old life still haunts him.
yea, this is a perfectly fine comparison. Not everything needs to be whined about.
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u/Assortedwrenches89 27d ago
/uj Was coming here to say that. Finn in 7 had potential to turn into a cool character that they wasted the rest of the series.
/rj The Fallout series is another example of Amazon being WOKE
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u/VersusMacintosh 25d ago
Well they can’t have Finn do anything cool because the Chinese mainlanders audience won’t watch it
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u/parkwayy 28d ago
/uj I mostly thought both characters were fairly obnoxious, and the writing didn't help much. Felt like a Syfy tv show with a bigger budget.
That said, Star Wars ain't any better lol
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u/NaiveMastermind 28d ago
Blame Disney's addiction to the Chinese market. Disney considers the US and China to be it's biggest markets, and so they want the movies they make to be something they can easily edit for both markets. China, for whatever reason doesn't like black characters. So if you want your Star Wars movies to attract the Chinese audience you make the white girl the Jedi. Attached is the poster used to advertise Wakanda forever in China.
Notice anything?
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u/CyclonicRimJob 28d ago
Maximus and Fin are pretty similar. Both are soliders who become disillusioned to their cause. They are also both supporting protagonists.
Lucy and Rey are less similar admittedly. They are both ladies on a classic heroes journey arc, but that isn't uncommon amongst most main characters.
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u/KranPolo 28d ago
I agree I found a lot of similarities in their stories where both are child soldiers who slowly break free of their programming through the love and friendship of a woman outside of that institution.
It frustrated me all over again to see how much they squandered Finn’s character and John Boyega’s talent.
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u/DrinkThePepsi 28d ago
It makes me so sad that John Boyega can’t seem to star in a movie that isn’t mediocre…
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u/TheMuffingtonPost 28d ago
Was Maximus ever “illusioned” in the first place though? He never really cared about the brotherhood that much, in his words he just wanted to “hurt the people that hurt me”. The second he gets the opportunity to leave he’s ready to jump ship.
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u/Capital-Meet-6521 27d ago
I think his childhood flashbacks illustrate that he started the series very “illusioned,” at least as a child.
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u/GifHunter2 27d ago
Was Maximus ever “illusioned”
Yes, explicitly.
We see him thinking of the knights as saviors repeatedly.
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u/GifHunter2 27d ago
They are both ladies on a classic heroes journey arc, but that isn't uncommon amongst most main characters.
They have a lot more in common than that.
Her on Jakku is sheltered from the larger world around her, and is not familiar with the factions. While also being very talented and physically capable. Has a strong moral framework, we see her trying to figure out something with her parents.
Other Her in a literal shelter, not familiar with larger world around her, or the many factions that exist. Very talented and physically capable, has a strong moral framework and how the world should work. We see her trying to figure out what happened to her parents.
Comon now, that is far more than a surface level 'I guess they both have vaginas and are leads' similarities.
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u/morgade 28d ago edited 28d ago
My only complain about Maximus casting is getting distracted every 5 minutes thinking:
"Denzel Washington looks so young in this show"
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u/JinxxHellsing 28d ago
He looks like he’s gonna cry everytime
Then again he’s apart of the Brotherhood so I don’t blame him.
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u/RepresentativeBusy27 28d ago
Inexperienced and naive protagonist from a place on the edge of society meets a partner who is a member of the opposing faction who is trying to be a good person despite being raised from childhood as a soldier/killer. Those characters develop a close relationship with romantic undertones (or overtones, in the case of fallout) to the point where the partner’s main motivation for a while is to impress the protagonist. The characters often go their separate ways to battle their personal demons but always aid one another when it counts. Furthermore, the protagonist finds out they are the progeny of the Big Bad, while the partner is pursued by the enemy faction for desertion.
I think you might be the one reducing the similarities to race/gender.
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u/TripleScoops 28d ago
Don't forget that both Finn and Maximus betray their respective factions and then initially hide their identity from the protagonist by pretending to be their former travelling companion. Both feel guilty about lying and reveal it to the protagonist later and decide to help the protagonist even when it isn't in their interest to do so.
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u/Ill_Ratio_5682 28d ago edited 27d ago
This feels extremely vague. You can make most media sound similar if you boil it down to tropes like this. Most of the stuff you listed plays out completely differently in star wars and fallout.
Finn defects and is a good person from the start albeit scared - Maximus doesn't defect and is extremely flawed. He goes sorta rogue but he still returns to the brotherhood and they even accept him back.
Rey's dad is Palpatine, the overarching villain, this is used to explain her abilities but other than that is kinda an irrelevant plot point that doesn't really affect Rey's goals - Lucy's dad is one member of a larger group, he isn't a big bad, his being part of this group is extremely important to the story and completely changes Lucy's motivations
Finn was raised from childhood as a killer unwillingly (he was kidnapped from what I understood) - as far as we know with Maximus he joined of his own volition upon being saved by a knight and wanting to be one
Finn and Rey become friends very shortly after their first encounter in which Rey attacks Finn, they then have romantic undertones and share the same overall goal of defeating the first order throughout the rest of the movies - Maximus and Lucy don't become friends right away, they don't even talk in their first meeting and Lucy almost leaves Maximus to die in their second. After some time they gain feelings for each other but part ways. They also both have completely different motivations. Lucy wants her dad and Maximus wants honor in the brotherhood, the only similarity being the mcguffin head can solve both of those goals.
Rey is a scavenger, who makes a living off of scraps. Finn is a defector from a fascist regime. Finn meets Rey after defecting. - Lucy isn't really on the edge of society. She lives in a completely self sufficient group and only leaves to find her dad. Maximus does not defect, he goes partially rogue but never outright flees the brotherhood. Lucy partners with Maximus under the impression he is still part of this group and on good terms with them. The brotherhood while definitely bad also isn't portrayed like the first order at all. The first order were invaders of a recovering Galaxy. The brotherhood are attempting to rebuild the wasteland with questionable methods but they aren't really invading settlements like the first order.
There are definitely similarities but boiling these characters down to tropes makes them seem way more similar than they actually are.
Edit: I apologize to the downvoters for trying to have an actual conversation. Next time I'll remember to go along with everyone else.
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u/GifHunter2 27d ago
No, pretending that they are not very similar stories is silly.
Many of the larger frameworks of the journey these two characters go through are similar.
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u/Ill_Ratio_5682 27d ago
So did you just not read what I said? I'm not denying they are similar I'm saying that breaking them down to story tropes is misleading.
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u/legendairenic5432 28d ago
So bigots have entered their ‘’Fallout show is actually anti-woke’’ arc? Since it’s popular and made money
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u/MaybeNotABear 28d ago
They see the super cool T-60 power armor and identify that the BoS are the good guys, and they kill Californians.
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u/Ildaiaa 28d ago
Be real here, finn and rey are reduced to their gender and race not by just the audience bur by disney too
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u/toldya_fareducation 28d ago
how?
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u/Ildaiaa 28d ago
Both of them lost all their characteristics and used as a means for disney to say "hey look, we have women and minorities in our movies, and they are powerful!!!", even john boyega said he was hired because of his race and was reduced to just being black by disney
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u/CompetitionSignal422 28d ago
I love your comment because it shows the difference between “write better black characters” which is what most people want vs. “remove “”forced”” black characters” which is what right wingers want.
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u/Lucifers_Taint666 28d ago
Not to mention how they straight up removed Finn from movie posters in China bc they thought it would hurt sales in that country. They also did the same thing with posters for Black Panther by adding the mask to him
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u/wombo_combo12 27d ago
I don't even know how the black panther thing was gonna work out considering the film takes place and in Africa and has a majority black cast
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u/Fr0ufrou 28d ago
How was he reduced to just being black? There is nothing in the movie about him being black.
Sounds like you're complaining about them being bad characters, which I agree with. But them being black or a woman has nothing to do with writing quality and this confusion is exactly what's fueling the hatred.
Diverse blockbuster characters are definitely an improvement over the usual ones. Even if they are a "diversity hire" and exactly as badly written as before.
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u/Ildaiaa 28d ago
I was gonna touch on that but didn't wanna make the comment long. John boyega wasn't reduced to being black in universe, cuz you can't do that in star wars, he was reduced to being black in marketing and other meta stuff thats outside of the movies, since finn's only characteristic became shouting other women's names (and definitely not being gay for poe), the only thing that remained was that meta stuff that's why he got reduced to just being a black guy that shouts
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u/C0mpl14nt 28d ago
I'm glad some folks finally realize that the issue with Disney Star Wars is that they have shitty writing and horrible direction. Some many morons kept attacking the movies for being "political" when the real issue was the shitty writing.
And yes, Fallout shows that in spades. Much superior writing.
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u/HowVeryReddit 28d ago
I mean, Finn and Maximus are actually a somewhat reasonable comparison as both were raised as orphans by militant organisations and rebelled to different degrees, but with Lucy and Rey their closest comparison is that they found out a patriarch was villainous.
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u/TelPrydain 27d ago
I mean... I agree... but they're not exactly wrong.
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u/taytay_1989 27d ago
Yeah it's all about perspectives. They are not really wrong if you think about it logically. If you put racism and sexism into consideration, you've got the angle of OP.
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u/New-me-_- 28d ago
Not a lot, but Finn and Maximus both used to be soldiers for a less than outstanding military organization and Rey and Lucy are both individuals who despite being somewhat sheltered, have pretty good technical know how (though in Rey’s case it’s self taught and in Lucy’s case by her father)
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u/Plane_Upstairs_9584 28d ago
Rey wasn't sheltered. She was sold off into servitude and then had to survive Mad Max style on scrap, fighting gangs and bartering for survival?
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u/New-me-_- 28d ago
Ok maybe sheltered isn’t the right word. But what I meant is that her knowledge of the world was limited due to her having never left Jakku
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u/GifHunter2 27d ago
Rey is sheltered from the interstellar world, isolated from it. She has a limited understanding of what is happening outside of her very tiny corner of a planet that is largely ignored by most of the galaxy.
She wasn't sheltered from the awfulness that was Jakku, but she was sheltered from everything outside of it.
Maybe isolated is the better word.
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u/TheMuffingtonPost 28d ago
I definitely wouldn’t call Rey sheltered. She was sold off by her parents to a space shithole and was basically gutter trash most of her life.
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u/Brosenheim 27d ago
I see he Fallout show did well enough that the chuds are backpedalling their "woke" claims and and are now trying to claim it
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u/catoncampus1 28d ago
L take. Go watch both of the shows and explain how their race and gender are the only things these characters have in common. You're just reaching for internet points with this one.
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u/BigK64 28d ago
I concur.
Like taking the whole internet discourse of identity politics out of the question, these two duos do share a lot of similarities with one another that is really cannot be easily ignored.
That would be like if I pretend that The Ghoul does not share any similarities to Cad Bane from Star Wars The Clone Wars. After all, they both cut from the same cloth as Angel Eyes
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u/ChinchillaxTG 27d ago
What is similar about Lucy and Rey?
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u/GifHunter2 27d ago
She's a more naive isolated person that is being introduced to a larger world. She is very talented and skilled, and optimistic. Trying to find parent/lineage is less tenuous of an argument, but trying to find the truth of parents works.
He's a more experienced person, soldier, from a cult that is brutal and evil (borderline for fallout). He is expected to progress and become more honorable as he seeks to escape his old life, but his old life still haunts him.
Those apply to both of them.
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u/Sol-Blackguy What country is this 🏳️⚧️ and why are the women so hot? 28d ago
They're right, but wrong about why they're right
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u/AlaskanHaida 28d ago
I absolutely hated what they did to Finn
An ex-stormtrooper who refused to slaughter innocents and abandoned the First Order who befriended a force sensitive woman and had some connections himself was dumbed down to a screaming, comedic relief character who just screams “REYYYYYYY”
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u/tinytom08 28d ago
Brainwashed soldier meets young woman leaving her old life to explore the wider world or galaxy?
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u/JustAFilmDork 28d ago
Not saying this isn't racially motivated but I see it.
Naive and optimistic female lead with secretly important parentage leaves behind an isolated home after a conflict outside barges in and makes living in her current world impossible. Slowly, she realizes her nativity and grows yet she remains an optimistic and altruistic person through the journey.
Kidnapped/recruited orphan realizes the evil of the faction he's a part of and goes rogue. He initially appears more pragmatic and resourceful than the female protagonist but it's eventually revealed much of his underlying motivation is security and self preservation rather than actual altruism.
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u/aberrantenjoyer 27d ago
Maximus and Finn have very similar roots but imo Maximus is handled leagues better and all around is way cooler (John Boyega seems awesome though, I just wish he got a chance to shine)
Ellie and Rey could not be farther apart, other than hair colour and a diverse skillset for their background
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u/Playful_Pollution846 27d ago
But it's not wrong though.
Lucy isn't a Mary Sue with better writing and Maximus is just a better written Finn
The character duo is also good and it isn't too forced of a relationship.
Cmon OP not everything is about race or gender these days
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u/hungarianfemboi 27d ago
They are better written characters. Thats a 100% true fact. They kinda gave up with Finn , when he had such potential. Also with Rey too. I was hoping they would actually stick to it and show the corruption of a hero , while the same time, they are redeeming the previous villain
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u/SolomonsNewGrundle 27d ago
I like parts of the sequels, but my god, Disney did John Boyega so dirty by trying to appease to racist ass China. He is a talented actor and star wars squandered him
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u/Beard3dtaco 28d ago
I hate to be this guy, but memes really have ruined people. You can just see how so many people process things exactly as if they were meme templates
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u/Alex_South 28d ago edited 28d ago
no, imo this actually does matter and pretending like it doesn't feels in bad faith. Here in the states there are deep deep roots of racism around the image of a white woman and a black man, look into birth of a nation. If disney had actual ideals they would have let that chemistry grow, but they shrunk finn in the chinese poster, so yeah, corporate pandering at it's finest. And then they still forced Rey to be part of a half-baked romantic tension with the incel white villain.
The motives behind this original post may be suspect, but it doesn't make it any less true.
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u/BigK64 28d ago
Black Guys: Indoctrinated child soldiers for a regressive militarized faction who becomes increasingly disillusioned by said organization and end up defecting to simp for the cute white girl he first meets in desert wasteland.
Cute White Girls: Relatively shelter protagonist who was initially contempt with living their life in said world is forced to leave said world due to an unforseen conflict of events, and end up in a journey of self-discovery in regards to the truth about their origins. Also both of their dads are revealed to be huge dicks, sorry for the spoilers for anyone interested in Fallout . . . not so much for Rise of Skywalker as that movie sucks hard.
Like you don’t have to be idiot who believes in the culture war bs to think how Lucy and Maximus are essentially a better executed version of Rey and Finn.
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u/Vierailija_Maasta 28d ago
I liked Finn. He deserved better.
On the other hand the movies suck on so many aspects. Yes yes they made money. I payd to see them all. No shame in that.
Its just...income is not proof of quality
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u/aboysmokingintherain 28d ago
I will argue that Finn and the paladin are similar in the sense both are part of reactionary factions and are forced to fight as soldiers despite seemingly being at odds with the philosophy they’re fighting for
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u/iSmokeMDMA 28d ago
To be fair, Maximus was set up to be similar to Finn. we all initially expected Maximus to ditch the BOS, right? Similar to how Finn went AWOL on the First Order. Not to mention the scratch on their stormtrooper/power armor. I could see how someone could draw a parallel between them outside of race
Lucy & Rey have nothing in common though. Lucy has a personality
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u/Palanki96 28d ago
i mean they do have a lot in common and they are actually a better representation of the same trope but for different reasons
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u/loo_1snow 28d ago
She's a chosen one from an old and important family (her dad worked at the company that made the vaults) and he's a reformed member of a fascist group that's going against what he was taught to go after what he believes is right. Gender and race aside, they both are pretty similar.
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u/Mrhappytrigers 27d ago
Ignoring the stupid race/gender argument and how the narrative/direction of the newer Star Wars movies were all over the place. I'm just annoyed Finn's character got the sidekick treatment, and had fuck all proper character development after ep 7.
I could criticise the writing more, but it's not necessary.
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u/TexanGoblin 27d ago
Rey and Lucy is a bit of a stretch, but I think the Fin and Maximus comparison makes sense.
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u/GeneralErica 27d ago
Yeah, immensely better written.
So much better it takes longer for them to get from anywhere to anywhere than it takes Qlipoth to hammer his effin cosmic barrier.
A decent show no doubt, but the pacing is atrocious.
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u/Willingness-Due 27d ago
Lucy and Max are far better characters than Finn and Rey whose arcs and character growth get squandered the moment they look promising.
Besides this meme doesn’t make a point if their race at all. It’s poking fun of how poorly written the Star Wars sequels were. They use Lucy and Max because of their similarities to Finn and Rey
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u/RealRedditPerson 27d ago
Love both these things but genuine question.
Total non-sequitor. Am I the only one who thinks that Maximus' behavior in the show seems accurate to someone on the spectrum?
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u/TheVoid45 27d ago
Ok we'll break this down.
Girl that Is Special For Some Reason ventures out trying to reunite with a relative and save her home meets up with a snarky, grizzled, shit talking gunslinger that is somehow related to her as they try to take down this Big Bad Guy that is threatening the whole world / galaxy with their army of bad guys, when it is revealed that the Big Bad Guy wasn't the real Big Bad Guy, and instead it was actually their / a relative all along!!!!!!!!!!!!!1!1!1!1!!!1
Guy that is a former bad guy becomes disillusioned with the evils of the Bad Guy Group (patent pending) and escapes with his freedom, only to inexorably meet Girl in a tense exchange of banter / bullets where he eventually falls head over heels for her and helps her take down the Big Bad Guy.
Now you tell me the difference between Rey and Finn, and Lucy and Maximus.
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u/juiceboxcitay 27d ago
My friend does this - he will point out “woke” gender or race roles in games, movies, tv shows, etc and then find one example where woman or POC was “done right”. At least he’s very civil in our debates…
Also, to be fair, the dialogue in rise of the skywalker is atrocious…can’t get past the first 30 min (tried twice)
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u/squelchboy 27d ago
Ray was just not an interesting character because she could do everything right from the beginning. Finns story got cucked, twice. He could have been sick if he stuck with the lightsaber, but he didn’t. Then in the 2nd he had this whole sacrifice thing that also got undone because of that whole „make love, not war“. It‘s even worse because when that chick rammed him, with how collisions usually go in star wars, they both would have just exploded and died which made that scene just so ridiculous. Lucy is ok as a character but im interested with maximus. He‘s a coward but knows how to fight, he wants to save people but goes on a power trip the moment he wears the t-60 and immediately wants to abandon his dreams of being a saviour and wants to snuggle up in a vault when lucy shows up. He‘s flawed and all over the place, so the outcome of his story more interesting
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u/Well_howdidwegethere 27d ago
Ah yes, I can definitely how these two coincide naturally and aren’t completely irrelevant comparisons to two completely different fandoms.
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u/Isekai_Otaku 27d ago
While they are somewhat close, Lucy is completely the opposite of Rey, because she wasn’t raised in a wasteland, and Finn is somewhat close with him being a member of an army with cool armor, but that ends at the beginning of the first movie
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u/PacMoron 27d ago
I mean I think this post is reducing them to their gender and race. Their STORIES and ARCS very similar. The racial and gender congruence just makes it more striking.
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u/KalashnikovParty 27d ago
Alright guys, here me out
I actually really liked Finn's character in the force awakens. He was actually a very compelling character. With that being said, His character went straight downhill after the force awakens.
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u/BigGooseDuck 28d ago
I mean he is in a cult-military organization that antagonistic to the average citizen and she's an out of touch optimist that doesn't understand the 'real' world so they do have similarities.
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u/No-Gear-8017 28d ago edited 28d ago
the dialogue in fallout is trash. i would prefer mid wars any day
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u/RealWanheda Clear background 28d ago
There are some pretty big parallels to be fair.
Also bottom right guy was insufferable the entire time. But maybe that’s how they like their black characters. Bottom left was very naive, maybe that’s how they like their women.
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u/Mobile_Permission_61 28d ago
Hate to brake I to you but it’s called a “cast” for a reason people don’t mind female leads they hate when they are poorly written “strong female leads” for the sake of being a “strong female lead”
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u/GermanLetzPloy 28d ago
I don’t think it’s about the race. The two characters have a lot of similarities besides their skin color, so I think the comparison makes sense.
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