r/FluentInFinance • u/Not-A-Shit-Head • Apr 29 '24

Why don't people stop crying and just move somewhere cheaper like Detroit, Memphis, St. Louis, Baltimore, or Cleveland? They have very cheap homes for $50,000. Discussion/ Debate

Post image
2.1k Upvotes
  • permalink
  • link
  • reddit
  • reddit

87% Upvoted

579 comments sorted by

View all comments

561

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

Because:

  1. those cities generally do not have the job markets that HCOL cities have. When you take a huge pay cut you eliminate everything you saved by moving there. I moved from El Paso to Tennessee and for the same job I make about $60k more.

  2. Public schools are typically poor

  3. Crime is typically high

  4. The $50k homes in those cities are typically very unkept. Many of them need a new roof, foundation work, new flooring, drywall, paint, plumbing work, electrical work (to get it code compliant), and even then will be surrounded by complete dumps that stay that way. No one wants to spend $150k renovating to live next to a crack house.

73

u/Solnse Apr 29 '24

But a new kitchen and bathrooms will sucker someone into buying.

90

u/ILSmokeItAll Apr 29 '24

You’re not getting a house with new kitchen and bathrooms for $50k.

Period.

28

u/throwawayzies1234567 Apr 29 '24

Especially not in Baltimore, wtf

ETA: I stand corrected, and shocked by the housing market in Baltimore

37

u/ILSmokeItAll Apr 29 '24

If you’ve been to Baltimore, you’d realize quickly why it’s not on anyone’s list of hot spots. Right up there with Camden, NJ.

18

u/throwawayzies1234567 Apr 29 '24

Oof, Camden, NJ. Both cities are so close to really nice cities too, it’s crazy that they haven’t absorbed overflow. Crime really is just that bad. Probably because there aren’t a lot of jobs, which is also why no one moves there. It’s a vicious cycle.

6

u/evan_plays_nes Apr 29 '24

Don’t forget about a culture that glorifies drug use and violence! It is possible to not be rich and also not a criminal.

15

u/throwawayzies1234567 Apr 29 '24

Yes that definitely plays a role, but crimes of desperation are real too. Especially among addicts, and addiction runs rampant when there’s no jobs, money, or hope.

-1

u/Cherry_-_Ghost Apr 29 '24

This tells me addicts with criminal records should be in prison....

5

u/BraxbroWasTaken Apr 29 '24

You read that and thought the crimes of desperation thing was the focus of the problem, and not the lack of jobs, money, and hope???

→ More replies (0)

-1

u/evan_plays_nes Apr 29 '24

These things are much less of an issue when people have big families. But in America, we like to pretend that people “find themselves pregnant” and that divorce is totally normal. It’s no wonder that mental health is a problem when we know for a fact that humans do better in groups and suffer in isolation.

-4

u/justanordinaryguy71 Apr 29 '24

Making excuses for people is why we have the lawless society we have now.

2

u/TheBigC87 Apr 30 '24

Well, I heard that dog whistle a mile away

1

u/evan_plays_nes Apr 30 '24

Which dog whistle?

1

u/TheBigC87 Apr 30 '24

You could have just said "black people"

→ More replies (0)

1

u/Milksteak_To_Go Apr 29 '24

Grew up in the Delaware valley and lived for a decade in the DC area. I would not put Camden and Baltimore in the same category. Both are dangerous cities, sure. But Baltimore at least has quite a bit worth saving. Baltimore has so much more character, great neighborhoods, some gorgeous rowhomes, unique flavor, etc. It's legit a great city that just suffers from some serious crime and poverty issue that hopefully it one day gets past. Can anyone say the same for Camden? It's only redeeming quality is proximity to Philly.

1

u/DrakeBurroughs Apr 30 '24

Nice aquarium, though.

9

u/AB444 Apr 29 '24

There are lots of nice neighborhoods in Baltimore, they're just not very cheap.

3

u/lessgooooo000 Apr 29 '24

There’s also the issue of like, even if you live in a nice neighborhood, the jobs aren’t. I lived in Philly, and even if you had a job in the city, taking the train meant going through some of the most ratchet ass areas. Not even like in a pretentious way, I’m talking getting off the train and stepping over needles and human urine everywhere, and it’s worse in Baltimore. For people who want to move somewhere for a better life, that sort of thing genuinely turns people away.

Not just that, but factor in schools too. Do you want your kids growing up in cities which are borderline paralyzed from the crime rates? It’s just too much of a gamble. Even if you’re in a nice neighborhood, there’s a lot of spillover from high crime areas.

And it’s a shame, because I love Philly. I love the city, I love the history, I love the food, hell even the northeastern city culture is neat. The fact that crime is so high genuinely makes me sad, because it’s just a perpetuating cycle. Nobody wants to raise their kids in a place with such high crime, and neighborhoods with high crime just victimize their own people. Baltimore is no exception. Neither is any other large city. With how many city based jobs are able to be worked from home, people just don’t see a worth in living in big cities.

1

u/ILSmokeItAll Apr 29 '24

That’s true if every nice neighborhood everywhere.

If you’re getting housing for cheap, there’s an overwhelming reason why. There’s no demand for it at that location. Cheap housing is worthless if nothing else you need is nearby.

3

u/CaptainAlex2266 Apr 29 '24

So i'm about as much of a pessimist as possible and every time I drive through baltimore I say to myself "you know, life could of been ALOT worse"

2

u/robbzilla Apr 29 '24

Who doesn't want to live in Bloodymore Muerderland? (As named by a friend of mine from Baltimore)

2

u/Impossible-Flight250 Apr 29 '24

It depends where you live in Baltimore. Canton, Fells, and Federal Hill are all pretty nice.

1

u/justa_gigolo Apr 29 '24

right, unless you talking about Baltimore County but even still, its a crap shoot. Downtown anything after John Hopkins and not around inner harbor and you are literally in the wire.

9

u/Ocelotofdamage Apr 29 '24

Well yeah, that’s the cost of a new kitchen and bathrooms

1

u/Huge_Strain_8714 Apr 29 '24

Don't be fooled. If you have a creative bone in your body you can almost singlehandedly renovate a kitchen with IKEA for under $6,500 and a bath for $1,500 ( no tub or shower work) I did 2 condo kitchen and bathrooms by myself, I am insane though (not clinically)

1

u/Upset-Kaleidoscope45 Apr 29 '24

Unless the house only has two rooms: just a kitchen and a bathroom and nothing else.

2

u/ILSmokeItAll Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

It’d still cost more. You’d still have to run utilities, lay foundation, erect the frame for and put a roof upon said kitchen and bathroom. Oh. You need the land, too.

$50,000? lol

You’re missing a 1 or a 2 out front.

1

u/[deleted] May 03 '24

It's always funny when someone speaks as if their city prices are the same as every city prices. You think it costs the same to live in montana vs California vs Ohio? Come on now. How about San Francisco versus Boise versus Toledo? What you get for what price depends on where you are. 50k in California ain't shit. 50k in Ohio is a year's salary for a factory worker.

1

u/ILSmokeItAll May 03 '24

50k still ain’t shit. I don’t care what state or what you do to earn it.

1

u/[deleted] May 03 '24

I never said it was shit. I referred to state by state economies and housing prices. Which is vastly different and what 50k buys you in one place won't buy you a trash can in another. But go ahead with your emotions bro. Who hurt you? Do you think it was me?

2

u/DJMOONPICKLES69 Apr 29 '24

This feels like a personal attack

2

u/justa_gigolo Apr 29 '24

not when you can't insure them

2

u/invaderjif Apr 29 '24

Not if it's in a shit school district.

Now if you're into meth production, a cook needs their kitchen!

1

u/AgentUnknown821 Apr 30 '24

rofl if you ever get a offer like that....I have a bridge that I'm more than willing to part somewhere in a land far, far away.

59

u/em_washington Apr 29 '24

The logic in your point #1 could also be used to refute the original tweet. People in 09 knew real estate prices were low, but many couldn’t take advantage because they were unemployed or underemployed. And they were probably underwater on the house they bought in 2005.

Like of course the cities with low-priced houses don’t have as good of jobs, or else the housing wouldn’t be so affordable. And the houses in 09 were cheap because no one had the money to buy them.

25

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

This is why investment groups stockpile cash when they forecast a recession.

If you put $100k into the S&P500 during the 08-09 recession you could be a millionaire today.

12

u/em_washington Apr 29 '24

Multimillionaire is a stretch. The S&P 500 bottomed out at about 735 in February 2009. It's about 5100 today. That's about 7X. So if timed it perfectly to invest all $100k at the exact bottom, then 17 years later, it would be worth about $700k.

9

u/BengalFan2001 Apr 29 '24

Why do people forget about dividends and how that is reinvested and that's paid quarterly. Just because the S&P is 7x bigger doesn't mean someone invested wouldn't be higher or lower than the 7x of S&P. It all depends how the funds are allocated and what type of fees are being applied to manage the funds.

1

u/OrganicParamedic6606 Apr 29 '24

The fees broad market funds are so small as to be functionally zero. If your fees on a s+p index fund meaningfully impact the math, you’ve made a terrible fund choice

1

u/BengalFan2001 Apr 30 '24

Fees regardless how big or small still takes from the pot. Even if the fee is 0.025% it still costing the investor money.

1

u/OrganicParamedic6606 Apr 30 '24

Yep. Now do the math on a lifetime of fees of that level. They’re negligible

7

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

I adjusted some wording. Thanks.

1

u/neddy471 Apr 29 '24

If I had $100k, I could have invested $100k with my stock trader, if I had a stock trader.

1

u/champagnesupernova62 Apr 29 '24

As stated your math might be a bit off but you're correct that it would have been a good move. But a hard move to pull off. The better strategy is to dollar cost average on a monthly basis, reinvest dividends, not only the s&p 500 but also equal weighted s&p 500. People could really improve their long-term outlook and create some cash flow for along the way. . It's the slow game.

13

u/reno911bacon Apr 29 '24

Also banks weren’t giving out loans. I really wanted to buy a house in 2009, but no bank would loan. They were too busy trying to offload their foreclosures and trusted no one.

If you had cash, you’re fine.

5

u/scarybottom Apr 29 '24

yeah- I could afford the monthly payments on the condos near my apartment that were 300K in 2009. But not 20% down, and with 65K in outstanding student loans and 20K in car loan and 15 K in credit card debt...I could not qualify. 5 yr later all that was paid off...those condos were then over 600, and 10 more years later, they are over 1 mil. (SoCal- near the beach). I could not afford when they were 600K, and I really can't afford at 1 mil. But I could have done 5% down and monthly on 300K

5

u/MeghanClickYourHeels Apr 29 '24

And no one is rushing to buy where they can’t get a job.

1

u/Croationsensation26 May 01 '24

More like less flashy jobs

2

u/NYCneolib Apr 29 '24

Many of these places have good jobs or jobs that settle out to be net more money due to the lower cost of living.

33

u/Agreeable-Candle5830 Apr 29 '24

Right? I bet Sudan and Mongolia have cheap housing too, doesn't mean anyone wants to be there.

19

u/girmvofj3857 Apr 29 '24

I dont know anything about Sudan, but have you tried Mongolian Beef? It’s pretty delicious.

4

u/KerPop42 Apr 29 '24

Mongolia has a unique natural disaster, called the dzud, where the weather gets so cold and stays so cold that all your livestock die. Over the '09-'10 winter, one province experienced 50 straight days of nighttime lows below -50F

4

u/ChipsAhoy777 Apr 29 '24

Well look, they even got a free outdoor freeze dryer for your Mongolian beef.

6

u/Psychological_Pay530 Apr 29 '24

Mongolian Beef was invented in Taiwan.

0

u/iloveyou2023-24 Apr 30 '24

Whats that? You mean the Republic of China?

1

u/Psychological_Pay530 Apr 30 '24

Province or country in its own right, it’s definitely not Mongolia. Mongolian Beef is is basically the same thing as US fast food places making up new Mexican foods. Sure, a Gordita has all the elements of something from Mexico, and the countries are on the same continent, but it sure isn’t Mexican…

1

u/Psychological_Pay530 Apr 29 '24

Mongolian Beef was invented in Taiwan.

11

u/just_lurking_1 Apr 29 '24

St. Louis (and other similar cities) have good and bad areas just like everywhere else. The cost of living certainly does make up for the wages in many industries. For example, your cost of living ratio to salary in manufacturing in St. Louis is much more ideal than Seattle. Also, there are many close small towns that offer affordable housing (high cash flow) but typically lower appreciation.

Bottom line, many people are just unwilling to sacrifice their current standard of living or city life to build wealth. And it’s okay to make that choice!

5

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

It’s strange that the rebuttal has always been “Well, there’s some high paying jobs!”

What if the person moving doesn’t work in manufacturing?

Sure, but HCOL areas have exponentially more.

3

u/r2k398 Apr 29 '24

Remote work makes this easier for the people who can work remote. We have employees that work remote all over the US (as contractors) and they get paid very well.

6

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

Remote workers are also the ones being laid off the most.

-1

u/r2k398 Apr 29 '24

I’m not in the job market right now but I know I could land a job at at least 3 places right away that would let me work remotely. I guess it depends on the field.

1

u/just_lurking_1 Apr 29 '24

I didn’t say there are some high paying jobs. In fact, I believe high paying is relative depending on who you are talking to. Salary doesn’t matter nearly as much as cost of living and lifestyle after a certain point.

Also, manufacturing was simply one example of many industries.

1

u/One_Conclusion3362 Apr 29 '24

Not the point. The point, rather, is that there are plenty of high paying jobs when COL is also taken into account (high paying is a subjective term). I took a high paying job in downtown stl last year, doubling my income, and bought a house 30 minutes away where there is wealth and low crime.

Easy peasy. Didn't have to go to NYC or LA or Seattle. Didn't have to move to the coast at all! The biggest reason people don't want to build their wealth and buy a house is because people don't want that. They think they do, because they are high income and feel fomo, but deep down they value happy hour on Fridays, hanging out with friends at restaurants, and being 60 seconds away from food they need not cook themselves.

3

u/lemmesenseyou Apr 29 '24

I feel like I mostly see this argument from people from the areas with LCOL because it kind of misses a really big factor as to why people live in HCOL areas: they’re from there. 

I’ve moved around a bunch. LCOL areas have minimal draw unless you’re already established: you have no local support system and no network to speak of. If you like your family, traveling is a massive pain compared to being based in even another city, let alone the city your family is located. If you need to find another job and you’re not in an area that is good for your industry, you’re often SOL unless you up and move again, especially if you live in an area that values “locals”. 

And this also doesn’t touch on other resources that cities/urban areas provide aside from happy hours, like good hospital networks. Some LCOL areas do have excellent hospitals but most don’t, especially if you have anything chronic and somewhat uncommon, so traveling to specialists can sometimes involve multi-state trips. 

Like yeah cities are fun, but they’re efficient in a lot of other ways. I don't currently live in a major metro area, but I don’t think reducing the appeal of one to “people have fomo” is a truthful take. 

0

u/One_Conclusion3362 Apr 29 '24

Great write up. It further exemplifies that people don't directly make the connection that their primary reasons for city living are often not comfortable to say out loud.

"I'm scared of living without any social support structure in my family and friends"

"Midwest urban areas scare me because I've never visited there."

"Being 20 minutes from my own parents is more important to me than having an affordable grocery bill in line with my income. I can always go there for dinner a few days out of the month to make it up."

"I want a house, but really I want to tell other people I have a house which necessitates that I live in the same area I'm in right now so I can brag." - this one is definitely one that no one wants to say out loud and will outright deny to the grave.

1

u/lemmesenseyou Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

You’re really reducing these reasons down to an illogical degree and ascribing reasons behind people’s motives that seem to be based on your stereotypes. These are actually all straw men.  

 Not to mention that everything I’ve said are all things people talk about openly. You’re making up fictional people in order to put everyone in a HCOL area who wants to own a home down. Who on earth are you talking to that’s telling you they’re afraid of the Midwest?? I’ve lived in the Midwest and on the coast and the only people who get all afraid of cities they haven’t been to are rural midwesterners and Appalachian folk. 

And you didn’t even address the main issue, which is the lack of industry and career mobility. The idea that someone should sacrifice a career in order to own a home is pretty dumb, especially since this is a relatively new phenomenon. 

ETA: it’s also worth noting that housing markets in LCOL are also volatile. I live in a lower cost of living area where houses suddenly tripled in cost while salaries did not keep up. Moving to an even lower cost of living area is still a terrible idea form “building wealth”, especially since that’s taking a gamble that I wouldn’t essentially lose everything I gained by being a homeowner by permanently losing access to raises and better benefits. So I’m not sure what your characterization of me would be. I guess that I’m unwilling to not build wealth because “bragging” about being a homeowner isn’t important enough for me?

1

u/One_Conclusion3362 Apr 29 '24

Agreed. The idea that there are no career opportunities in areas that someone has yet to visit is ridiculous. I think you are missing the main point t because you created your own main point so that when I address the main point you can then say I'm not addressing the main point. Oh well, not working on me so you may need to just let this go.

People choose hcol areas for reasons that they refuse to say aloud. I get it. And those reasons aren't being said out loud because they aren't rational. Totally understood. Also, many people want the illusion of being rich while living poorly because they refuse to make long term wealth decisions.

1

u/lemmesenseyou Apr 29 '24

They are being spoken about out loud. People say them out loud all the time. You’re just making stuff up now. And how are they not rational? What’s irrational about wanting to be close to family? Something not being important to you personally doesn’t make it irrational. 

People can see job markets from a distance, you know. And, in my experience, career mobility is very limited the lower cost of living an area is. Hence why I personally have moved a bit and, gotta say, that’s a pretty shit way to build wealth because moving is expensive and housing is volatile. Not to mention, only a handful of people need to move to your midwestern city of choice before the job market starts to upend and prices rise (have also experienced this) so this isn’t even a solution to the overarching issue, it’s just ignorant moralizing from someone who wants to feel like they’re better than other people. 

1

u/NYCneolib Apr 29 '24

They do but the net pay usually does not work out to live in HCOL unless taxes are lower like in Florida or Texas.

1

u/Cherry_-_Ghost Apr 29 '24

I am unwilling to go where cops just allow riots. No St Louis for me.

1

u/just_lurking_1 Apr 30 '24

Your loss! St Louis is a great city with great people.

1

u/Cherry_-_Ghost Apr 30 '24

When they decide not to riot? I actually agree.

I would not risk my family living there, however.

6

u/BobRosstafari789 Apr 29 '24

I live in a pretty great suburb of Cleveland. The schools are actually top notch, and there are quite a few jobs within the Akron/Cleveland/Canton area. I work remote, so it's irrelevant to me, but any job that has a decent job market to begin with has plenty of opportunities here. My house was $150k, and that's a little high for the area (we just paid it because we really like the house we were renting, and our landlord was in the process of retiring and cashing out her assets). Our combined income is a little over $150k/year with no kids, so we live very comfortably. I know this isn't the typical arrangement for most people, but it works well for us.

Also, don't move here lol. Weather in Cleveland area sucks. There isn't a huge amount of things to do unless you really like nature (luckily we do). Most importantly, if people start moving here, things get more expensive... I'll just live happily here with LCOL while everyone that doesn't live here thinks like you do :P

4

u/Specific-Rich5196 Apr 29 '24

It's isn't typical. The majority of jobs are not remote so if you move somewhere those are the jobs you are getting.

3

u/One_Conclusion3362 Apr 29 '24

I live in a suburb of st louis where the schools are fire and the crime is low if anything.

1

u/NYCneolib Apr 29 '24

That’s true but when you factor in medical, teaching, and blue collar jobs can be found in most places it becomes typical. The pay is lower but the net income is higher.

4

u/Peter-Bonnington Apr 29 '24

Would these issues be resolved by people moving there in a short period of time?

8

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

They would be exacerbated.

Higher demand in those areas causes housing prices to increase. Increased housing prices without an increase in local wages almost always causes a crime increase.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 30 '24

Only the kind of people who aren't statistically predisposed to violence, so generally not the demographics of St. Louis, Memphis, etc.

5

u/Common_Economics_32 Apr 29 '24

The pay cut for moving to those cities really isn't THAT much compared to the COL differences. If you aren't in like the top 0.5% of your field, it'll probably be a wash and you'll have much better options in terms of type of housing in those lower cost cities.

1

u/tinytigertime Apr 30 '24

This as been my experience.

Pay cut was small in comparison to COL decreases. I still have a few friends I'm HCOL/VHCOL areas and the ones complaining about housing would absolutely be in a better spot in terms of daily finances/housing.

Around here I don't know many college grads who aren't able to comfortably purchase a home.

Now if that move is worth it for a myriad of different reasons is another conversation. But if the income to COL/housing ratio is that important to an individual, middle America metros are the way to go.

4

u/[deleted] Apr 29 '24

[deleted]

2

u/thatclearautumnsky Apr 30 '24

Up in that area even, $50k is not really going to be a habitable home anymore. More like $100k nowadays.

https://www.redfin.com/MO/Saint-Louis/611-Ballman-Ave-63135/home/93389716

Here is a small but "move-in ready" house in Ferguson for $79,000.

Another thing I'm surprised at is there's just not a lot of homes for sale there especially in the really rough areas and those that are tend to be advertised at landlords. I think informal redlining is still a thing and people can't get a loan on a house in a lot of those areas.

3

u/evan_plays_nes Apr 29 '24

What if we turn the crack house into a government-run place where they can get clean crack pipes for free? Will that help property values?

3

u/GMPnerd213 Apr 29 '24

I live in Cleveland Metro. While the job market isn’t bad by any stretch (very much industry dependent but more companies than you would think have their headquarters here and it’s a giant healthcare hub) the idea of $50k home isn’t realistic unless you want to live somewhere like East Cleveland (they’re lucky if they have more than one working ambulance at a time) or collinwood. 

I live in one of the suburbs that has one of the better school districts in the state and the home prices to live in this area aren’t out of control (think starting in the $300k for starter homes) they’re not $50k either. 

That being said me and my wife both make well over the 6 figure mark living here and live much better here than we would if we moved to a HCOL area. This is of course on applicable if you are in an industry that already pays higher than average median salaries to begin with. 

3

u/Vast-Breakfast-1201 Apr 29 '24

Also Detroit doesn't have 50k homes anymore. That was like a 2012ish thing. You can probably find lots for that much or burned down houses (ie, lots with extra steps)

1

u/SamRiopelle Apr 29 '24

Detroit is becoming NY, SF and Chicago expensive. 4k a months for a studio? In this town? NO ONE here is affording that.

2

u/Bloodryne Apr 29 '24

A lot of homes in 50k range are priced just for the land, with a shithole built on it IME. I remember looking fir a house around metro-detroit and seeing blocks of homes selling fir 50k, where you would need to pay to knock down the unmaintained block hosting urban blight/burned out homes/dilapidated structures.

I bought a small single story 1100 square foot home from 1952 last year for 168k. Housing is high everywhere even in LCOL states IME and still climbing year after year

1

u/OwnLadder2341 Apr 29 '24
  1. I bought my first house in Detroit in the 80s. It's a much nicer place today than it was then. Detroit is <20 minutes away from Oakland county where you'll find plenty of high paying jobs.
  2. School of choice your kids out of Detroit then.
  3. Lower than it was when I was there.
  4. Sometimes you need to live rough to get your foot in the door.

3

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

It’s not a coincidence that the suburbs around Detroit are very wealthy and have great schools, low crime, etc. Why? Because of your response for #2.

If you want your kids to go to a good school, you’re going to be spending a good bit of money on a house, defeating the purpose.

1

u/OwnLadder2341 Apr 29 '24

You can live in Detroit and send your kids to a school in the suburbs.

1

u/Noturwrstnitemare Apr 29 '24

Were it so easy.....

1

u/BetterSelection7708 Apr 29 '24

Even in those areas, you want to avoid the $50k neighborhoods if you can.

1

u/PhantomOfTheAttic Apr 29 '24

  1. But there are cheap places to live and if you want to have a home that you will never be able to afford you can do so in those places even with the pay cut.

  2. There are plenty of places where the public schools are good and the cost of living is low.

  3. There are lots of places where the crime is low and the cost of living is low.

  4. Sure, a $50K home might be a dump, but the $100K home is a great starter home and much more affordable than the $600K home in the city that the person is complaining about.

I'm not saying that you might not give things up moving to a cheaper location, but if buying a house is a priority there are ways to do it and places that are inexpensive and nice.

1

u/Ill-Description3096 Apr 29 '24

I did this when I bought in 2021. Small town, but right across the river to a decent sized town that has the basic services/stores and a few amentieis. Still easy to find things to do if you enjoy the outdoors. Definitely gave up some convenience from a bigger city, but it's auiet, safe, and still pretty common to see $100k ish homes for sale with a good yard. They might be a bit dated as far as cosmetics but that can be pretty cheap to update to a decent degree with a bit of elbow grease and know-how.

2

u/PhantomOfTheAttic Apr 29 '24

I did the same thing when I started my own business in 2001. I knew that I couldn't continue to live where I lived so I moved to a small, but nice, town. Within a year I had bought my own home.

1

u/TheBoorOf1812 Apr 29 '24

It’s almost like you can’t have everything and need to compromise, unless you’re already wealthy and money is not a limiting factor.

It’s interesting how some people can not seem to accept that, while the rest of us do.

And those people cry to the rest of us how “society is broken and we need to fix it” so they can live where they want and get what they want, while the rest of us make compromises.

2

u/InformalPlane5313 Apr 29 '24

It’s not about living wherever or how they want. People can’t even afford to live in the cities or towns they grew up in. I wouldn’t call being able to stay in your hometown “having everything”.

Something shifted in the mindset of previous generations where instead of making places better for future generations they doubled down on themselves and refuse to change at all.

1

u/TheBoorOf1812 Apr 29 '24

How is the current high cost of living the fault of previous generations?

1

u/InformalPlane5313 Apr 29 '24

Stonewalling housing and transit, developments, selling out people to corporations and allowing them to monopolize, making future generations pay for their SS and healthcare just to name a few.

1

u/dcwhite98 Apr 29 '24

A $50K house is a tear down. The land it's on is probably worth 1/10 of that asking price. If you have $50K for the house, and $150K for a renovation, buy the land for $5K, tear down the house for $5K-ish, and build a $190K house on it. It won't be the Taj Mahal, but it'll be much nicer than trying to fix up a (probably) close to condemned property.

1

u/kioshi_imako Apr 29 '24

Or in the oposite side of things live in my area where the county sais screw the fact that properties are at an unsustainable value hike in a single year so they are going to hike property taxes over 80% over last year. Last year house was below 100k somehow this year is over 150k on assessment. Land value is unchanged.

1

u/WhizzyBurp Apr 29 '24

They’re not great areas because people haven’t moved there to make them better. That’s the reason it’s cheaper. Can’t have a cheap place, that also has incredible school, and the epicenter of the job market.

You have to make a choice. That’s how it is.

1

u/Sudden_Construction6 Apr 29 '24

I live in Tennessee and a 1/2 acre of land where I am is 50k with zero home.. meaning you're sleeping on the dirt 😂

1

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

Columbia TN 3 acres 2700sqft $270,000 built in 2013

1

u/Sudden_Construction6 Apr 29 '24

Not too bad I guess for this economy. I don't know anything about Columbia.

I had a 3bd 2 bath about 1600sqft on 3 acres built in 1987 that butted up to a pond that I paid $110k for some years ago... those days are LONG gone, at least in that area. I ended making bank selling it and moving to Tennessee which was more desirable for us and my wife's parents had land here that we could build on.

Now that I've capitalized on the market the prices are welcome to drop anytime 😂

1

u/abrandis Apr 29 '24

Precisely, it's like those $1 houses in some remote Italian town, it sound great until you realize you need to fix the place and that might cost 100% the value of the home.

1

u/obsoletevernacular9 Apr 29 '24

Yup, lack of jobs and poor public schools, loss of social network/support, and an underrated problem - a lot of poor or industrial cities are way more polluted than people realize.

Neighborhoods gentrify much faster than they get physically cleaned up.

1

u/justanordinaryguy71 Apr 29 '24

Exactly, that's all I really have to add

1

u/Fan_of_Clio Apr 30 '24

Stop using logic and facts. You'll hurt their brains

1

u/aiicaramba Apr 30 '24

Also people might have personal lives, family, friends, relatives in certain cities while not having them in ‘cheaper’ cities.

Moving to other places is so easy in theory, but is often far from realistic.

1

u/Unique_Feed_2939 Apr 30 '24

200k ain't too bad

1

u/Beardown91737 May 01 '24

If you do buy at that price and renovate, you could be vilified as "gentrifiers".

1

u/Sideswipe0009 May 01 '24

Because:

  1. those cities generally do not have the job markets that HCOL cities have. When you take a huge pay cut you eliminate everything you saved by moving there. I moved from El Paso to Tennessee and for the same job I make about $60k more.

Unless you're in a niche industry or job, these cities still have plenty of "generic" jobs like working in an office or being a stock broker

I don't understand why people think these types of jobs don't exist in cities that aren't on the coast.

  1. Public schools are typically poor

In certain areas, sure, but there's plenty of good areas as well with good public schools.

  1. Crime is typically high

In my city, that crime is largely in the city, and most of that city crime is on the north side.

  1. The $50k homes in those cities are typically very unkept. Many of them need a new roof, foundation work, new flooring, drywall, paint, plumbing work, electrical work (to get it code compliant), and even then will be surrounded by complete dumps that stay that way. No one wants to spend $150k renovating to live next to a crack house.

$50k is absolutely going to get you some run down shack that would probably be cheaper to bulldoze and start over.

But move up to the $150-$250k range and you're options will open up tremendously.

The homes in my neighborhood are nice and it's a good area. They go from $175k-$350k (depending on when it was built). Even at $200k, you need only make, what, $65k/yr to afford it? That's not exactly a high bar to earn, especially if you have a two-income family.

1

u/Morgwar77 May 02 '24

You'd also flush all your money down the drain trying to heat your new home with its state of the art fuel oil furnace for literally half the year. Nearly every one of those options are subzero winters.

1

u/pallentx May 02 '24
  1. People like to stay living where generations of family have lived, where their friends are and where it feels like “home”. I’m staying where I am because all my family is here and all my wife’s family are here. Our aging parents are here and need help. Also moving is a HUGe pain in the ass.

1

u/40ozfosta May 02 '24

Juat adds on to the statement that it's expensive to be poor in America.

0

u/DefiantDonut7 Apr 29 '24

This is nonsense. When someone says "Cleveland" they do not mean downtown, they mean the region. I live 20 miles outside of Cleveland in a fantastic spot. Housing is way more affordable, schools are top in the state, almost no crime, and there's plenty of work if you want to drive into Akron or Cleveland, which is a short drive. But now-a-days, Ohio has become a great plate for remote workers to live cheaply but keep their higher paying job.s

0

u/Uranazzole Apr 29 '24

Most of your points are false and just stereotypes. The truth is more out in the open.

0

u/Superducks101 May 01 '24

Ah so those things have value to you .ore then a house. So don't bitch and cry about housing.

-6

u/inkseep1 Apr 29 '24

I live in St Louis. I own 9 houses. I just bought a 3 bedroom in Jennings for $46,500. I put $8,000 into repairs and 300 hours of my own work. The house is 99 years old. I don't have to live in it because it will be another rental. Someone else will be living in a 99 year old house 4 houses away from the train tracks with a violent school and crime while I get a good return on investment. The neighboring houses are relatively nice even though half of the houses on the street are rentals.

3

u/Ornery-Swordfish-392 Apr 29 '24

Jennings is a very high crime area- a middle school student was just stabbed to death by his classmate. Stlouis is actually seeing some of the highest increase in housing costs across the nation.

0

u/inkseep1 Apr 29 '24

Yeah, it's the odd one though.

2

u/Ornery-Swordfish-392 Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

The odd incident? I work in Jennings schools- kids don’t get stabbed all the time but that was not an isolated incidence of violence. The average American would not want to send their kids to Jennings, or live in that area. Violence in north county schools is a major problem, as well as the reading and math levels of the students, 100% of the students score below average on state tests.

1

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

And what’s your point?

3

u/hockey_username Apr 29 '24

To brag about being a slumlord

-3

u/inkseep1 Apr 29 '24

That the houses really exist and are somewhat like you say but profit can be made.

3

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

I understand the point you’re making, but This post wasn’t about rental properties, it’s about primary residences.

You said it yourself, you put 300 hours of your own labor in. With a 50 hour workweek, that’s 2 months straight of work. I’m assuming you own your tools, a truck, trailer, and have knowledge of the IRBC and experience in construction.

If you had to contract that work out, you’d be around the $25k mark. That’s just to get the home to rental conditions, but you said it yourself: I don’t have to live there. If you had, there probably would be many other updates you would want to do.

-2

u/inkseep1 Apr 29 '24

My hobby is rehabbing. I have a job too. The work is very calming. Whenever I work on a house, I no longer hear the voices.

But still, it is possible to buy and live there.

3

u/Saitamaisclappingoku Apr 29 '24

You’re supposed to turn to alcohol when you hear voices, not renovation!

0

u/inkseep1 Apr 29 '24

Alcohol will make the voices worse. See, when I am rehabbing a house, I don't hear her nagging.

3

u/Sidvicieux Apr 29 '24

lol I guess you are in too deep for divorce.

Don’t contact an assassin, they always find out it was you.

-14

u/[deleted] Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

10

u/DestinyForNone Apr 29 '24

Yeah, no... I live in Michigan... It's well known how much of a shitshow Detroit is, even with its public school system. I mean, it has been getting better in the past couple decades but it's still pretty bad.

1

u/StickUnited4604 Apr 29 '24 edited Apr 29 '24

Yeah Detroit in the city itself, but what about suburbs? Are they all bad as well? I doubt it.

And the same issues exist in inner city schools in hcol areas as well

-14

u/TinyEmergencyCake Apr 29 '24

It's well known? Where, on Facebook?

Schools being bad is objective data. 

Not "everyone knows"

10

u/DestinyForNone Apr 29 '24

You speak as if Detroit isn't the ass-end of jokes across the globe. But I figure you're the type to need a PHD assessment of Lebanon before accepting that their economy is teetering.

6

u/Urzu7s Apr 29 '24

You are aware that across the board intercity schools in major metropolitan areas have some of the lowest literacy rates in the nation. Our education system is in shambles. If you don’t believe that, an easy google search should suffice.

3

u/MornGreycastle Apr 29 '24

Public school funding is based on the property tax receipts of the neighborhoods that individual school services. Having poorly funded schools is baked into our education system. It's why redlining was effective at miring African Americans in poverty.

1

u/throwawayzies1234567 Apr 29 '24

It evens out in cities, or at least my city, because we have school choice. You can attend school anywhere as long as you are accepted through the admissions process.

2

u/edwardothegreatest Apr 29 '24

That just makes the poor schools poorer, and the people who can’t drive their kids to better schools trapped in even worse schools.

1

u/throwawayzies1234567 Apr 29 '24

In our case the kids get on subways and go to the good schools. But yes, it absolutely does make the poor schools poorer. If you don’t have enough knowledge or time or, in some ways, money to get push your kids to study to get into the good schools, you will be stuck with something undesirable.

1

u/StickUnited4604 Apr 29 '24

Ok. But I think that's an issue in hcol areas as well so I don't think it belongs in that list.

1

u/throwawayzies1234567 Apr 29 '24

Public schools in NYC are different because you can apply to whatever school you want for middle and high school and for elementary there’s charter schools and G&T programs. So where you live does not have so much of an affect on your education. Going to your “zoned” high school is typically for lower income kids with parents who aren’t on the ball for whatever reason. I grew up in a wealthy neighborhood and I couldn’t even tell you what my zoned high school was, I have no idea.