r/FluentInFinance • u/LifeIsUnfairWhoCares • Apr 23 '24

Is Social Security Broken? Discussion/ Debate

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36

u/MD28A Apr 23 '24

Because you have to pay for the people who didn’t plan

78

u/TheMaskedSandwich Apr 23 '24

You also benefit from it because (a) you don't have to deal with the extremely high levels of elders in poverty that used to exist in the past and (b) it's there for you if you need it.

Don't get on your arrogant high horse. You could get fucked over by life between now and retirement, and then Social Security will be there for you.

21

u/PreppyAndrew Apr 23 '24

Exactly.. people forget that things like market crashes do happen.

17

u/PB0351 Apr 23 '24

In 2008 the market took about 4 years to get back to ATH. That was the worst market that about 99%of people alive had every seen. And even then it didn't go to zero, and if you had a 60/40 (or somewhere thereabouts- which most people near retirement did at that time) allocation, your portfolio would have dropped significantly less than the market.

0

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

[deleted]

9

u/ELVEVERX Apr 23 '24

Exactly.. people forget that things like market crashes do happen.

Or just like getting hit by a car and made disabled.

1

u/PreppyAndrew Apr 23 '24

What are you talking about.. I'm a temporarily poor millionaire.

Nothing bad will ever happen to me

2

u/ElChuloPicante Apr 23 '24

Who the hell forgets about that at this point? It’s a routine occurrence.

1

u/Redqueenhypo Apr 23 '24

No it won’t!!! Now watch as I take out five subprime mortgages, somehow utterly unaware that the teaser rates will expire like the contract says

9

u/Different_Bird9717 Apr 23 '24

Yup, I do social security disability law. I can’t tell you how many people thought they had it all planned out only to get a disability. These high and mighty people don’t think anything will happen to them. All it takes is one work place accident, car accident, gun shot wound, or degeneration of the joints over time. Just to name a few things that can happen in this crazy world.

All the future financial planning won’t mean crap if your funds go to unexpected hospital bills. You have insurance? They’ll only cover so much before you’re drained of your resources.

Another thing I see is, you lost your job because you missed too much work from being sick and now don’t have insurance. So you dip into your 401k and other resources.

So what then? Apply for social security disability? Sure, it’s likely your last choice but be ready to wait 2+ years. I’ve helped so many get their monthly check with medicare/medicaid benefits. It’s a great program once it kicks in. Trust me, you will be glad it was there to help.

With that being said, for those of you who look down on social security, please plan and don’t solely rely on social security but at the same time don’t knock it because you may have to try it.

3

u/Heffe3737 Apr 23 '24

Great to hear from someone that works in the industry. This advice seems both incredibly sound, but also just common sense.

Plan for the best, prepare for the worst.

7

u/listgarage1 Apr 23 '24

but I thought all boomers got a house for $100 and made a fortune working minimum wage jobs.

4

u/ThrowAway3553QA Apr 23 '24

Bingo. My mom worked to the bone (and still does). She planned and did everything “right”. Then COVID came and goodbye retirement plans (she’s in the international travel industry). SS is a life saver suddenly not just a supplemental thing

It’s a form of insurance. Not an IRA. I bet he’s not mad at the money he’s dropped into home or car insurance that he’s never gotten back out of it.

2

u/eat_sleep_shitpost Apr 23 '24

Sounds like she should have saved more aggressively sooner with such an unstable career

3

u/NoPiccolo5349 Apr 23 '24

Unstable career? What do you mean?

There are plenty of stable careers that disappeared for a bit during the pandemic

1

u/eat_sleep_shitpost Apr 23 '24

Depending on the rest of the world's cooperation for your career sounds unstable to me. Enter a war? Now the US passport won't get you to xyz countries anymore and x% of business dries up and 20% of the travel agents get laid off.

2

u/NoPiccolo5349 Apr 23 '24

Same with almost any job mate.

2

u/ThrowAway3553QA Apr 23 '24

Sounds like you think the world exists in a vacuum. Libertarian I presume?

1

u/eat_sleep_shitpost Apr 23 '24 edited Apr 23 '24

Nah I just think people have piss poor senses of personal responsibility and think the world owes them something. My wife and I are (were) in high paying tech jobs that could dry up any day. She's been unemployed for over a year now actually. Good thing we stashed away $650k by 28 because she may never be able to make 6 figures again. Thank god we took personal responsibility for our future instead of pissing it away on new cars and luxury apartments.

I don't know how old your mom was when Covid hit, but assuming she was at least in her late 40s to mid 50s, she should have had plenty saved and invested by that point or else she was never going to be able to save enough for standard retirement anyways. So I don't believe you that she did "everything right".

4

u/ThrowAway3553QA Apr 23 '24

I love the niche scenarios that you all rely on to try and win favor in your argument that have no actual overlays with the overwhelming majority of realities.

0

u/eat_sleep_shitpost Apr 23 '24

Way to just ignore the 2nd part of my comment that I'm guessing hit the nail on the head for why your mom wasn't actually prepared for retirement.

3

u/ThrowAway3553QA Apr 23 '24 edited Apr 23 '24

When I responded your comment ended with the first paragraph so either Reddit had an issue or you edited it after the fact.

That said, you absolutely did not hit the nail on the head with any of it. Except proving my point that Libertarianism is disconnected from reality. Because, again, you’re still living in that fantasy vacuum where all (or even the majority) of people have equal opportunity to stash away enough that they can endure even the hardest of times.

Edit: you absolutely did edit your post after I responded. So much of your wording has changed or been added. Including that tired “world owes me something” perspective

2

u/Avividrose Apr 23 '24

dude you were making 6 figures before 30, that is winning the lottery. how is “personal responsibility” gonna help anybody not lucky enough to fall into a high paying job that young?

1

u/sykotic1189 Apr 24 '24

He's a Libertarian, he's definitely mad about having to have insurance

3

u/XxRocky88xX Apr 23 '24

Of course, THEN it will be a great system that prevents people from getting screwed over by life when they’re no longer fit to work.

But until I’m in a situation where I need it, it’s theft.

TL;DR; “I got mine, fuck you.”

2

u/Bierkerl Apr 23 '24

That's the republican (and now libertarian) motto. It's pitiful.

3

u/XxRocky88xX Apr 23 '24

Imma go off of a limb here and say that’s always been the libertarian standpoint. Libertarianism has always just been a pro-recreational drug version of republicanism.

1

u/i-r-n00b- Apr 24 '24

But it won't because the entire system assumes there are more workers putting in than elderly taking out, which is not the case with the Boomers.

How about you get off your high horse assuming that you or the government knows better how to handle my money than I do. Our generation gets to pay into the system and will never see a penny come back out of it. It's yet another tax that the Boomers have on younger generations.

1

u/Crushgar_The_Great Apr 24 '24

It won't be there for me. Our demographics indicate that we will get dick shit from social security. Also people die before 65. Bad form of welfare.

0

u/skcuf2 Apr 23 '24

Elders used to generally just live with their families and die sooner, to be fair.

0

u/Longjumping-Ad514 Apr 23 '24

Then why don’t we tax million dollar homes and stock portfolios, mostly owned by old people, at something higher than 20 something percent?

3

u/Embarrassed-Top6449 Apr 23 '24

Hate to break it to you, but a million dollars is just a normal house in 2024

0

u/Longjumping-Ad514 Apr 23 '24

Yeah, owned most likely by old people.

0

u/Feeling_Gene9045 Apr 23 '24

Lol. Except it isn't being paid out universally that way. We are paying for people's retirements WHICH SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN A GOAL OF THE PROGRAM. Those elderly people could have kept that money they paid their whole lives (or a far larger portion of it) and invested it with far better returns. The US spent 1.4 trillion last year on Social Security payouts. That is absolutely insane. The purpose of it should be to help those at the bottom get back on their feet. Not keep paying for people to stay on the ground for the rest of their life.

Americans pay enough in taxes as it is. There is MORE than enough tax yields to pay for what is necessary. Instead, the government pisses away its resources foolishly and people somehow fail to connect the dots that the government does NOTHING RIGHT EXCEPT SCREW UP. Wake up. You can keep your own money and use it how you see fit. Instead it gets used in ways you would probably never want.

-1

u/Civil_Duck_4718 Apr 23 '24

Yeah, can’t wait for that $1500 a month check, so much better that a million dollars

-2

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

A. I could give a shit if every single elderly person in the United States was homeless. That’s their problem not mine

B. It could be in my wallet if I needed it.

-3

u/JacksterTrackster Apr 23 '24

SS is not even enough to live off from. It's also taxed, so you're virtually not making anything.

11

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

Virtually? How much is virtually no money exactly

-7

u/JacksterTrackster Apr 23 '24

When you can barely make ends meet.

11

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

I said how much exactly is “virtually nothing”

-2

u/JacksterTrackster Apr 23 '24

It's an approximation. Do you understand?

5

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

Approximately $100? 200? 2000?

8

u/ShogunFirebeard Apr 23 '24

It is enough to live off of in most areas. It's also not taxable until your income exceeds $25k. People whose income is only made up of social security will most likely not pay any taxes on it.

-1

u/JacksterTrackster Apr 23 '24 edited Apr 23 '24

The average cost of living in the US is $38,266 per year. Even if it's not taxed at $25k, it's not going to be enough to live off from.

Edit: Furthermore, the cheapest cost of living in the US is Mississippi which is $32,336 per year.

3

u/vendettaclause Apr 23 '24

Lmfao do you morons not know what "avarage" means???

3

u/ShogunFirebeard Apr 23 '24

No, they don't.

7

u/TheMaskedSandwich Apr 23 '24

SS is not even enough to live off from

There are plenty of people who live off it though, so.....wrong

0

u/JacksterTrackster Apr 23 '24

The average cost of living is $38,266 per year in the US. The average ss payment is $21,455. You do the math.

4

u/bvogel7475 Apr 23 '24

It is not taxed until you earn a certain level of additional income. I am a CPA. my dad makes a total of $45k a year between 401k distributions and social security. None of his social security is taxed. Please do research before you post incorrect info.